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 Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.

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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 7:09 pm

I've been looking up the various ways to try and determine tobacco age from tin dates. Not to be confused with archival/artist tin dating, but more concerned with the contents.

So far I have--

Known:

Cornell & Diehl - mmddyy

GL Pease - mmddyy

McClelland 1st 2 digits = product ID 3-4th digits = batch code 5th - 6th digits = year tinned.

Mac Baren (old method) AABBCCCD (A = Machine) (B = Year) (CCC = Calendar Day linear number) (D = Shift)

Mac Baren (new method) - date printed on can

Assumed:

Dunhill/Orlik - yymmXXXX? (vertical left, next to UPC)

Peter Stokkebye (branded/variations) yymmXXXX? (vertical left, next to UPC)

----------------------------------------------------

Anyone else have any leads or anything to add?
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alfredo_buscatti

alfredo_buscatti

Age : 64
Location : Piedmont, North Carolina
Registration date : 2007-12-17

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:04 pm

Though I like it when the blender gives MM/DD/YY, I've come to settle for the year. Many tins are completely undated, and I go by the date I put it into my cellar.
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Carlos
Admin
Carlos

Age : 61
Location : Chestnut, IL
Registration date : 2007-12-10

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:50 pm

No dates on Dunhill's, except for style of tin and what we write.

_________________


"Never turn your back on a Breen".
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Hermit

Hermit

Age : 66
Location : Ascension Parish
Registration date : 2008-04-22

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 8:57 pm

Escudo has a date code.
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 9:00 pm

Hermit wrote:
Escudo has a date code.

Yep...there's a number on other PS stuff that may or may not be date-related...I want to find out for sure. The Dunhill stuff is strikingly similar. All of my tins of both that I've bought recently have "10s" or "11s" on them in the first two digits. Again, it's wild, arm-waving speculation.
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DirkT

DirkT

Location : Tucson, AZ
Registration date : 2011-12-07

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:18 pm

Kyle Weiss wrote:
I've been looking up the various ways to try and determine tobacco age from tin dates. Not to be confused with archival/artist tin dating, but more concerned with the contents.

Assumed:

Dunhill/Orlik - yymmXXXX? (vertical left, next to UPC)

Anyone else have any leads or anything to add?


I have a tin of Dunhill Early Morning that I bought a couple of weeks ago.

Horizontally printed to the left of the UPC:
1100030223
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:27 pm

DirkT wrote:

I have a tin of Dunhill Early Morning that I bought a couple of weeks ago.

Horizontally printed to the left of the UPC:
1100030223

My new tin of Nightcap has 1107XXXX and my EMP is 1005XXXX.

*shrug* Until someone can find a 2132XXXX or a 1387XXXX I'm still speculating. Or, it's the tobacco of tomorrow... today!!! Laughing
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Cigar2you

Cigar2you

Location : Havre de Grace, Maryland
Registration date : 2010-04-08

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Tue Jan 10, 2012 10:55 pm

http://www.loringpage.com/attpipes/tobdatepaper.html

Here is a great website that I use
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:15 am

Cigar2you wrote:
http://www.loringpage.com/attpipes/tobdatepaper.html

Here is a great website that I use

Kind of hard to date a tin of 2005 tobacco with information from 1997/1999... Laughing Cool
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Cigar2you

Cigar2you

Location : Havre de Grace, Maryland
Registration date : 2010-04-08

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:20 am

Nice to have for older stuff though
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riff raff

riff raff

Location : Western Maryland
Registration date : 2011-05-24

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:58 am

Hey, thanks. I'll have to check my mm965 tins. I bought four last week, but one is older, per the clerk as the price was a buck less. I was curious as to how much older, as this blend does better left to age a bit.
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billmess

billmess

Age : 45
Location : North New Jersey
Registration date : 2011-11-03

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:31 am

Riff Raff must really love that 965 stuff...





Bill
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 2:48 pm

I just got my first tin of 965 with my meer recently... code 1107xxxx
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Nonsailor

Nonsailor

Location : Massachusetts
Registration date : 2011-12-07

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 4:51 pm

DirkT wrote:
Kyle Weiss wrote:
I've been looking up the various ways to try and determine tobacco age from tin dates. Not to be confused with archival/artist tin dating, but more concerned with the contents.

Assumed:

Dunhill/Orlik - yymmXXXX? (vertical left, next to UPC)

Anyone else have any leads or anything to add?


I have a tin of Dunhill Early Morning that I bought a couple of weeks ago.

Horizontally printed to the left of the UPC:
1100030223

My tin of EMP has the same code.
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riff raff

riff raff

Location : Western Maryland
Registration date : 2011-05-24

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 8:25 pm

My four tins of 965 are stamped:
3 have: 1020101020 (one is priced differently and is supposed to be older)
1 has: 1122021715

Those numbers don't seem to have any calender meaning.
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 11, 2012 10:43 pm

I still suspect the first two digits are year. Production numbers, batch numbers and whatnot may follow... if we start seeing "12" on those tins come May or June (the earliest I suspect we'd see them, maybe) -- could be a clue.
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Rusty

Rusty

Registration date : 2010-06-04

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:23 pm

I'm a little skeptical about the relevance of the tin dating. Sure it's nice be able to identify the batch for the manufacturer when we're discussing it with them but do the dates really matter beyond that?

Yes, there are changes with age but the interval between noticeable differences gets longer and longer. Plus there are batch to batch differences with many that obscure the effects of age. Plus with some we don't have a clue as to their age with the manufacturer before the tinned date stamp is applied.

Take McClelland's for example. I always thought it was odd that the bulk tobaccos really change over the first little while but the contents of tins don't. When Mike McNeil explained that bulk isn't held to age but tinned blends are held to age that explained it for me. The tinned blends are further down the aging curve when they are released. So it takes longer before there is definite change. The interval between noticeable differences seems to run something like a Fibonacci sequence. So with tins or jars 1 yo, 2 yo, 3 yo 5 yo, 8 yo, 13 yo, 21 yo.... are the noticeable differences, just noticeable with the adjacent ones in most cases. And I presume that there are going to be batch differences that frustrate the effort to notice changes. But it also means that the differences between a 5 yo, 6 yo and maybe 7 yo are not noticeable and it gets worse with more age. So if you notice differences they're probably attributable to batch-to-batch variations or the tin experience. So the initial date is vague and the precision with which you know it becomes less & less important over time. So it's sufficient to know that it's current stock and mark the date purchased with new stock. The rest is a level of precision that really doesn't matter.

If you're buying aged tins precision matters even less. That they are approx. a decade old is enough info. Whether they're 9, or 10, 11, 12, doesn't matter. I would guess that their experience as tins ie how they were stored is probably more relevant than a precise age.
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Fri Jan 13, 2012 1:58 pm

As with taste and style, everyone's perception is different.

Me, a relative newcomer, might very well not be able to tell one stitch of difference between a four year old tin of Virginia Flake and a Six year old tin of the same variety.

However, some might.

The point further, if you have a cellared a number of tins of the same tobacco, it'd be nice to differentiate between the generations. Cool

So far, labeling-as-you-go is most common, but never clarifies when the tin was made or how long it sat on the shelf at the seller's.
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riff raff

riff raff

Location : Western Maryland
Registration date : 2011-05-24

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:41 pm

I sure saw a difference between new tin of MM965 and one that was four years old. I'm sure that varies by the tobacco blend/maker.
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Fri Jan 13, 2012 2:44 pm

riff raff wrote:
I sure saw a difference between new tin of MM965 and one that was four years old. I'm sure that varies by the tobacco blend/maker.

With that said, my new tin of MM965 I just got should sit for a while?
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riff raff

riff raff

Location : Western Maryland
Registration date : 2011-05-24

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:22 pm

Kyle Weiss wrote:
riff raff wrote:
I sure saw a difference between new tin of MM965 and one that was four years old. I'm sure that varies by the tobacco blend/maker.

With that said, my new tin of MM965 I just got should sit for a while?
I've read almost universally that it is far better aged. The new tin wasn't bad, my opinion, but the older burned better with a noticeable taste improvement.
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Fri Jan 13, 2012 3:24 pm

riff raff wrote:
Kyle Weiss wrote:
riff raff wrote:
I sure saw a difference between new tin of MM965 and one that was four years old. I'm sure that varies by the tobacco blend/maker.

With that said, my new tin of MM965 I just got should sit for a while?
I've read almost universally that it is far better aged. The new tin wasn't bad, my opinion, but the older burned better with a noticeable taste improvement.

10-4...I'll give it a year or so and see what it does. Cool
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monbla256

monbla256

Age : 73
Location : DFW Metroplex, Texas
Registration date : 2012-01-15

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Wed Jan 18, 2012 1:16 am

Kyle Weiss wrote:
riff raff wrote:
Kyle Weiss wrote:
riff raff wrote:
I sure saw a difference between new tin of MM965 and one that was four years old. I'm sure that varies by the tobacco blend/maker.

With that said, my new tin of MM965 I just got should sit for a while?
I've read almost universally that it is far better aged. The new tin wasn't bad, my opinion, but the older burned better with a noticeable taste improvement.

10-4...I'll give it a year or so and see what it does. Cool

I HIGHLY recomend that Smile I'm still working through some tins I bought almost 18 years ago and age does this blend well ! 'Course when I used to smoke it fresh it was the version blended by Murry and I have not bought any blended by the current source. But if it is close to the former, time does it well.
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Kyle Weiss

Kyle Weiss

Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Thu Apr 12, 2012 12:46 pm

Just some notes to add to this, as I'm still suspecting there's a method to the numbering system on some tins:

Orlik Golden Sliced Tins (Code, top left to UPC):

1) Written Date: 7/2008 Code: 0812015611 (1/12/08) (12/1/08) ?
2) Written Date: 4/2012 Code: 1110064731 (6/10/11) (10/6/11)?
3) Written Date: 4/2012 Code: 1110054731 (5/10/11) (10/5/11)?
4) Written Date: 4/2012 Code: 1110054731 " "

I still think there's something to consider when looking at the Dunhill (Orlik) tins and that code to the right or the left of the UPC, usually a 10-digit number. I'm convinced at least the first four (or even six) numbers have to do with the date. The OGS numbers I've compared on tins I've gotten recently is supporting this theory. Tins that now have "receive" dates written on them (by me, or someone else) if compared to what I suspect is the date, is always (possibly) about six months after the suspected "made by" date. Which, shipping, storage, and shipping to the customer would be about right.
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DrumsAndBeer

DrumsAndBeer

Age : 46
Location : Northern, CA
Registration date : 2012-04-04

PostSubject: Re: Comprising a list/guide to tobacco tin dates.   Thu Apr 12, 2012 2:10 pm

How do you determine the date on a S. Gawith tin? Thickness of the dust layer?
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