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 Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can

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alfredo_buscatti

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Age : 62
Location : Piedmont, North Carolina
Registration date : 2007-12-17

PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 12:21 am

It is Spirit.

Do you really want me to define Spirit?

Spirit is that which transcends the only apparent duality of life and death. It is that which allows manifestation, but which is also not manifestation. Neither is it non-manifestation. All things are ultimately ku (google "ku"). All manifestation is transient; everything dies. Everything is dependently originating; google that. Everything comes from something else, and the chain of manifestation only ultimately comes to rest on that hypothetical one cell that started blinking life way, oh way back when. What sparked that life? What sparked the conditions that sparked the conditions that spawned life? Was it already life? No. It was, as you have directed me, a universe that superposed infinite possibilities. Thus, there was a primordial matrix of conditions that spawned life; but life presupposes an environment. Once that environment existed it demanded life. . .And there was life? I guess.

It is impossible to define Spirit; language can't encompass It. Its effects can be described, or so I think; google the 32 Characteristics of the Buddha or the names of the leaders of the Boddhisattvas of the Earth; those names describe Spirit. My experience of Spirit is unbidden unexplained joy, strength, wisdom, yada yada.
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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 1:59 pm

Yak wrote:
I was wondering why my Yaktometer was vibrating !

cat What a Face king lol!

At your age, you're allowed certain stimulation where needed. Razz I love you Laughing

Cool
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Vito

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Location : Earth
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:20 pm

alfredo_buscatti wrote:
...Do you really want me to define Spirit?
Well, yeah, actually—I do...but only if you want me to know what you mean when you use that word as an answer to my question. There are too many possible interpretations of the word "spirit" for me to know which one (or more) applies to what you're talking about. I could guess, but I don't think that's a very productive way to communicate.

alfredo_buscatti wrote:
...Google ku.
I did, and after three pages of hits on the University of Kansas, various references to Kentucky Utility, and some fascinating but not particularly satisfying information on the viscosity of paint (Krebs units), I gave up. You're not making it easy for me to understand what you're talking about.

alfredo_buscatti wrote:
It is impossible to define Spirit; language can't encompass It.
I suspect that what you might really mean is that you don't know how to define it, and I can accept that. But if that's really true, then our discussion of "Ultimate Principle" is over. I don't know what it means, and the only answer you can give is a word that you can't define. I had inferred that it's some kind of principle that you can state concisely. Apparently I was mistaken. But if you can point me to something that isn't ambiguous or circular, I'm still open to understanding what you mean.

Perhaps you can state it in terms of pipeweed. We've had good success in our past discussions in that domain.

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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:26 pm

Vito wrote:
I suspect that what you might really mean is that you don't know how to define it, and I can accept that.

Classy answer. I can define "spirit." Just not with words. Not with music. Not with art. It isn't for other people, it's for the individual. So, I can describe the mindset and the emotion, feeling and sentiment from sunrise to sunset. And I'd have to keep doing so fruitlessly to others until I died for even a glimpse of connection, so I merely am selfishly satisfied with what I found--and try to keep company with others that are satisfied with what they find, no matter what the subject matter is.

Cool
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Vito

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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 2:56 pm

Kyle Weiss wrote:
Vito wrote:
I suspect that what you might really mean is that you don't know how to define it, and I can accept that.

Classy answer. I can define "spirit." Just not with words. Not with music. Not with art. It isn't for other people, it's for the individual. So, I can describe the mindset and the emotion, feeling and sentiment from sunrise to sunset. And I'd have to keep doing so fruitlessly to others until I died for even a glimpse of connection, so I merely am selfishly satisfied with what I found--and try to keep company with others that are satisfied with what they find, no matter what the subject matter is.
That's an even classier answer! cheers

For my part, I'm not sure I can define it directly either, but I can come close by backing into it from my definition of "spirituality", which I can define verbally with all the semantic precision I need. To wit, spirituality is the awareness of the interconnectedness of all things. On that basis, I guess I would have to say that "spirit" is something like "the essence that all things have in common".

I could elaborate, but since I don't insist that anyone else use my definitions, and I'm not willing to argue about it anyway, that's my best shot at a definition for now. Besides, all definitions are arbitrary anyway. They're tools we use for the convenience of being able to talk about stuff in a way that (hopefully) avoids the stupidest kind of arguments—namely, semantic ones.

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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 3:14 pm

I loathe arguments of that kind. It's that silly human nature some folks give into that must compete on a level to not who can define something better for understanding, but who can accrue the most ego while doing so. It's just a non-materialistic man's way of gaining his own self-worth and power. Some use money. Some guns. Some intellect. Some spiritual connection. We're baboons in fig trees, and that's the foundation of it. Speaking of figs, had a friend bring back some yard-ripened figs from Oregon recently, and boy howdy, those were good. No sense in describing them though...that'd just end up in the same place. You'll just have to all be jealous of my fortune, or kill me and steal them if you're into figs (just try it...). Laughing An experience is a sweet, sweet treat, sometimes just for the moment. The fact I find someone was willing to share them is also remarkably and uniquely human, and I am grateful.

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Vito

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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 5:16 pm

If you ever get down to SoCal during fig season, amigo, I'll be delighted to share some from my tree...non-baboonically.

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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Tue Nov 06, 2012 7:32 pm

Vito wrote:
If you ever get down to SoCal during fig season, amigo, I'll be delighted to share some from my tree...non-baboonically.


cheers

Fresh figs make this desert baboon/rat pretty darned happy, it turns out! Very Happy I'll refrain from proposing a fair trade; roadkill jackrabbit for said figs. Razz Ain't much fruit around here. (No jokes from certain Brothers, tempting as it is...)

Cool
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Simple Man

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Age : 56
Location : Atlanta-ish
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:00 am

Kyle Weiss wrote:
Vito wrote:
If you ever get down to SoCal during fig season, amigo, I'll be delighted to share some from my tree...non-baboonically.


cheers

Fresh figs make this desert baboon/rat pretty darned happy, it turns out! Very Happy I'll refrain from proposing a fair trade; roadkill jackrabbit for said figs. Razz Ain't much fruit around here. (No jokes from certain Brothers, tempting as it is...)

Cool

Hee hee hee... would have just passed right over my head had you not pulled it down where I could see it. Wink Laughing
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Vito

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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:13 am

Simple Man wrote:
Hee hee hee... would have just passed right over my head had you not pulled it down where I could see it. Wink Laughing
Must be an inside joke, not intended for outsiders. No

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Simple Man

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Age : 56
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Wed Nov 07, 2012 10:35 am

Vito wrote:
Simple Man wrote:
Hee hee hee... would have just passed right over my head had you not pulled it down where I could see it. Wink Laughing
Must be an inside joke, not intended for outsiders. No



'Tis only a bit of playground humor I generally miss. Kyle just made me take notice... I'll let him explain to you if he chooses. Neutral
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George Kaplan

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Age : 47
Location : Kalamazoo, MI
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:05 pm

At the risk of getting back on track by addressing the OP, does anyone remember this short film from the '70s?



Side note: Yes, that's the same Charles and Ray Eames who designed the Eames chair.
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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Wed Nov 07, 2012 1:39 pm

*shrug* I'm quite sly, in many senses of the word. We'll just leave it at that. Laughing No real inside joke, Vito. Preempting the gents to keep them on their toes.

Cool
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Vito

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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Wed Nov 07, 2012 5:36 pm

George Kaplan wrote:
At the risk of getting back on track by addressing the OP, does anyone remember this short film from the '70s?...
No, I was busy in the '70s, but before that I remember a book called Cosmic View: The Universe In 40 Jumps, by Kees Boeke (1957)...

...which was my first exposure to this method of putting the universe in perspective. I still have a copy around here somewhere.

As I watched the video, I thought, "Jeez...that voice sounds awfully familiar..." When I saw the credits, I realized that the narrator was physicist Philip Morrison, with whom I was privileged to share a few beers and some fascinating discussions in my undergraduate days...er, which were not in the '70s.

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MisterE
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Location : Mexico City
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PostSubject: Re: Wrap Your Head Around This...If You Can   Fri Nov 16, 2012 6:16 pm

I found this pretty interesting:


_________________
Many of the greatest pleasures in life are illegal, immoral, or smelly.

-Yak
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Anasazi6

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Location : Texas
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PostSubject: Once more on cats   Sun Jan 26, 2014 12:27 am

I find Vito's comments fascinating. However, since they are so incomprehensible, impenetrable and aloof I can only come to the conclusion that they were dictated to him by his cat.
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