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 I would like your opinion

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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: I would like your opinion   Mon Jul 22, 2013 2:22 pm

docwatson wrote:
Thanks again to all for the responses to my inquiry. I have restored my faith in this seller as well, even though at first I had my doubts. Staying even keel sometimes has its merits as this situation worked out for the better. Brothers of Briar a fine place to be when looking for some quality input and also just to be hanging out. Very Happy 

This is a good thing, and a rarity, when dealing in private commerce.  An exception rather than the rule.  I'm never sure who is right in scenarios involving "cooler heads"  versus nailing the suckers when the possible rip-offs start setting out their snares.  I detest people who would even be so lax to accidentally mislead someone in a sale.  It doesn't take a huge amount of effort to get details like "unsmoked" correct with a briar.  They're not complicated things, these pipes.   He couldn't bring himself to open the box and double-check?  scratch  I only expect someone do what I would...and I can handle checking simple details (among others) in a sale, and I'm not some lofty, degree-holding business executive.  Laughing

It's why we all have to be careful.  A rip-off with the intent of doing so is bad enough, only down the line a few clicks is the guy who is too busy, bothered or careless enough (perhaps not maliciously) to bother.   It becomes offensive due to a buyer trusting them to do that work (we're paying them) and them wasting our time and possibly our money.  For some, that's two scarce commodities these days.  A guy would have to be awful nice for me to give him a pass again...I ain't so lucky to roll a hard six, good or bad, so when it happens, I question things.   Laughing

We can't expect Doc to come running and checking out every listing we bid on.   Laughing Although it would be nice.  

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docwatson

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Location : Central Massachusetts and midcoast Maine
Registration date : 2008-03-21

PostSubject: Re: I would like your opinion   Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:30 am

I have to agree with you here Kyle. I had my doubts about this being a mistake myself. Personally I think it was intentional but there's no way to prove that so I accepted his excuse as an oversight. And the fact that the pipe was in such pristine condition it could pass as an unsmoked pipe. Now that the auction has ended it doesn't make me feel any better that he doubled the price that he paid me for it as well!!! Pretty nice flip I should say. Oh well, such is the retail world. However any time I see this seller's pipes I will scrutinize them closely.
I am a constant watcher on eBay and know many of the big pipe sellers. There are very few that I consider to be upstanding and truthful about their descriptions, good photos and disclosure of issues with pipes is most important. Then there are fellow collectors and sellers that attend many pipe shows to sell (not just buy) that I hold in highest regard. I would like to name some of these guys but would probably do injustice to those that I forget.
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PostSubject: Re: I would like your opinion   Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:45 am

No uncoated bowl smoked six times would look "new unsmoked" unless it were sanded out. Even a coated bowl would smell like whatever had been smoked in it & residue would be discernable in it (by sight & feel).

FWIW

What a Face 

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docwatson

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Location : Central Massachusetts and midcoast Maine
Registration date : 2008-03-21

PostSubject: Re: I would like your opinion   Tue Jul 23, 2013 10:57 am

Yak,
You are absolutely correct on that statement. As a matter of fact, on Peterson pipes and many others in mint, almost new condition a pipe will still show the impression of lathe jaw marks inside the tobacco chamber and the smoke hole inside the bottom bowl will be virgin wood in color unless it has been stained.
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ZuluCollector

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Location : Arlington, VA USA
Registration date : 2007-12-12

PostSubject: Re: I would like your opinion   Tue Jul 23, 2013 11:13 am

Yak wrote:
No uncoated bowl smoked six times would look "new unsmoked" unless it were sanded out. Even a coated bowl would smell like whatever had been smoked in it & residue would be discernable in it (by sight & feel).

FWIW

What a Face 


Yak's correct here. I would go a bit further. My experience is that one cannot make any smoked pipe feel unsmoked, no matter how much sanding of the bowl occurs. Smoke leaves readily discernible traces in the shank that are almost impossible to completely eradicate. Even alcohol-soaked pipe cleaners can't completely get the scent out. And too much alcohol treatment leaves that scent; it is a dead giveaway.

This issue keeps coming back up like a bad dinner with a couple of eBay sellers who are widely known to play fast and loose with the truth. The problem is, because it isn't really cool to name anyone without indisputable evidence of wrong-doing, it taints all the eBay resellers because nobody knows exactly who the bad actors are. I have one good pipe-selling friend who absolutely refuses to call any pipe unsmoked unless he personally bought it new from the pipemaker for retail. Because he can't *know* that a pipe is unsmoked, he won't represent it as that, no matter how pristine it appears to be.

Personally, I buy estates, particularly for my Blue Riband collection. I spend a lot of energy appraising condition, and even recently wrote a series on how I approach that process. For me, the value of any pipe isn't in that it is unsmoked; it is all about how rare it is, how good a specimen it is in terms of shape and grain, and how good the condition is. What hits the pocketbook hardest is a pipe that is highly sought-after, rare, a great specimen, and in wonderful condition. That pipe is going to be comparatively expensive whether it is smoked or not. I recently purchased a Blue Riband on Italian eBay that cost me a fortune compared to most other Blue Ribands I've bought. I knew it would going into the auction. However, for anyone else to assume that their Blue Riband is worth what I paid for a specific piece is naive wishful thinking in the extreme. All pipes are not created equal.

It is important to remember that selling-price is driven by the buyers, not the sellers. Some sellers have created a cadre of very loyal buyers; some sellers have developed a LARGE cadre of loyal buyers - a marketplace advantage that is stunning in terms of the profits it represents. It is disturbing to watch someone who is ethically challenged exploit such an advantage through false representation of the product, but it happens. It also happens that these people achieve high profits and high margins while playing fairly in the market. This evokes no little jealousy on the part of bystanders who would like to make the same profits. This advantage doesn't mean that these sellers are not honest, just very savvy marketers.
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Kyle Weiss

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Location : Reno, NV
Registration date : 2011-09-18

PostSubject: Re: I would like your opinion   Tue Jul 23, 2013 2:38 pm

Best thing any of us could do, in a classy way, is to promote the GOOD guys thoroughly...rather than flag-wave the countless, varying bad ones--which would take far too much effort. I love you

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