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 An interesting exchange on Facebook

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Bill

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Registration date : 2009-02-08

PostSubject: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:21 pm

Little Brown
The Lil Brown Smoke Shack team at the Las Vegas Tobacco Exp Show
launching our new Vision Hunter RYO Pipe Tobacco. We were also the
feature sponsor at the opening night Expo dinner!! Vision Hunter will be
available the end of March, 2010!!
Yesterday at 1:43pm

Bill Blevins
RYO "Pipe Tobacco" is why we who actually use pipe tobacco have H.R.
4439, the Tobacco Tax Parity Act of 2010 to look forward to. Thanks a
pantload.
59 minutes ago

Little Brown
I hear you Bill, but when the government increases the RYO cigarette
tobacco to around $24 per pound, that forces the industry (as I am sure
you have seen) to adapt and find ways to continue to serve the customers
that want affordable RYO tobacco. We used to have an RYO cigarette
tobacco, but when the taxes went sky high we had to adjust and ... See
Moreunfortunately that ends up effecting you. That is why we need to
continue to speak out against these outrageous taxes and the targeting of
the tobacco industry. If the government hadn't increased the taxes,
business owners across the country wouldn't have switched over to pipe
tobacco. Let's keep up the good fight...the fight for our dwindling
rights!!
30 minutes ago

Bill Blevins
I don't sympathize with cigarette smokers to the point I can say that
it's ok to devise ways to skirt the system at the expense of those who
don't smoke cigarettes.
3 minutes ago

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?
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Hermit

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Age : 64
Location : Ascension Parish
Registration date : 2008-04-22

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:37 pm

Bill wrote:

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

Smokers of the World unite!
We're all lepers on this bus.
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Frost

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Age : 39
Location : Somewhere near Philly, PA
Registration date : 2009-12-31

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:42 pm

Bill wrote:


Bill Blevins
I don't sympathize with cigarette smokers to the point I can say that
it's ok to devise ways to skirt the system at the expense of those who
don't smoke cigarettes.
3 minutes ago

Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

I smoke cigarettes and I don't even sympathize with myself to that point!
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jhuggett
BoB's Pioneer & Founding Father
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Age : 45
Location : Olympia, WA
Registration date : 2007-12-09

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 10, 2010 5:57 pm

It's a divide and concur situation as I see it. If pipe smokers want to stand by themselves we are a very small group with almost no say. The taxation laws really are to be blamed on the politicians not the users.

_________________
Jason

"Freedom, Security, Convenience: Choose Two"
"For me, I will take freedom over security and I will take security over convenience." ~ Dan Geer
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puros_bran
Nightrider
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Location : Brandenburg, Ky
Registration date : 2007-12-10

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 10, 2010 6:02 pm

Amen J.. Don't throw Any Body under the TAX BUS.
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Kapnismologist

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Registration date : 2008-11-09

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 10, 2010 6:54 pm

For all intents and purposes, there is NO distinction made between pipe tobacco, RYO, snuff, manufactured puffed-stem-and-chip cigarettes, cigars, blunt wrappers, cherry-flavored reconstituted sheet, etc., etc., etc. by the antis - it is ALL the devil's weed. The goal is the prohibition of all tobacco (or, in the case of much mass produced stuff: 'tobacco-like' materials). The modus operandi is that of incrementalism. Divide and conquer is an ancient strategy used effectively for millennia. Sometimes it is easier to 'clique-up' than to see the larger picture - but here we are talking about something much larger than the concerns of a minute minority of botique pipe tobacco enthusiasts.

I think the thoughtful meditation by Greg Pease, "Us vs. Them," is a good read in such instances:

http://glpease.com/BriarAndLeaf/?p=50
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Justpipes
The Duke
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Age : 58
Location : Randolph County, NC If you don't know, you wouldn't understand.
Registration date : 2007-12-17

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 10, 2010 8:46 pm

The question is......did you vote for the politicians that opened the flood gate of anti-tobacco legislation that has taken the nation by storm in the last 15 months?
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Handsome Dynamite

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Age : 27
Location : Hamburg, NY
Registration date : 2009-12-31

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Thu Mar 11, 2010 1:35 am

We (smokers and tobacco users) can't divide or we're all going to end up with a lot of hurt. It may start with one, but in the end they'll have gotten all of us. I do notice a fair amount of pipe smokers trying to seperate themselves from cigarette smokers, and no one else sees it like that, to them it's a line of tobacco and no tobacco.
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Hermit

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Age : 64
Location : Ascension Parish
Registration date : 2008-04-22

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Thu Mar 11, 2010 2:46 am

Handsome Dynamite wrote:
I do notice a fair amount of pipe smokers trying to seperate themselves from cigarette smokers,...

Elitist pricks! Laughing
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Wet Dottle

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Location : Littleton, CO
Registration date : 2008-02-27

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Thu Mar 11, 2010 11:40 am

Well, cigarette makers are the main culprits of the current state of the prevalent hostile attitude against smoking in general. Their actions provided ample amunition to help advancing the anti-smoking movement. Cigarette companies were never friends of pipe smokers, unhesitantly discontinuing blends that were not profitable (by cigarette sales standards). Now, they found a loophole in the law that they want to exploit, with disregard for any consequences. In other words, we (the pipe smokers) have been adversely affected by their actions and are now being tied down to the railroad tracks once again. I don't see any reason for us to sympathize with them. I just hope pipe tobacco companies have enough backbone to stand up for themselves while they can.
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PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:37 pm

Wet Dottle wrote:
I just hope pipe tobacco companies have enough backbone to stand up for themselves while they can.

They'll need deep pockets to buy enough high end lobbiest (i.e. politicians) to get the job done.
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Doc Manhattan

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Age : 39
Location : Land of Steady Habits
Registration date : 2008-05-26

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Thu Mar 11, 2010 12:45 pm

Wet Dottle wrote:
Well, cigarette makers are the main culprits of the current state of the prevalent hostile attitude against smoking in general.
Don't forget, the largest cigarette companies are also one of the culprits behind the usurious tax increase on RYO tobacco. Tax parity between homemade and premade cigs means more business for them, in the short term from people who switch back to premades with no price difference, and in the long term as they muscle out companies too small to weather the tax hikes.

I have great solidarity with other smokers of any kind; I'm not thrilled with the RYO companies seeking a loophole, but I understand. But I have zero sympathy for any tobacco company that supports anti-tobacco legislation. I'm holding back on my tins of CH and PA, because once they're gone, I'll never buy another Altria tobacco. (Fortunately, Granger is held by SM/ST, who don't have any premade cigarette concerns.)
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adauria

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Location : Wake Forest, NC
Registration date : 2008-02-28

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Thu Mar 11, 2010 2:55 pm

Yeah, no offense, but I tend to agree with the idea that we are all in this together. It's anti's against smokers. The increase in taxes on RYO was unjust. It's not necessarily right that this is going to end up hurting pipe smokers, but this was a foreseeable result of the ludicrous increase on RYO tax. And when they push far enough, they shouldn't be surprised that people will find loopholes or even black or gray markets.

For the record, I've never smoked a cigarette and don't want to.

-Andrew
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Bill

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Registration date : 2009-02-08

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Thu Mar 11, 2010 4:15 pm

adauria wrote:
And when they push far enough, they shouldn't be surprised that people will find loopholes or even black or gray markets.

I am fully prepared to buy tobacco on the black market if and when it becomes available and will do so without the slightest shred of guilt.
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adauria

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Location : Wake Forest, NC
Registration date : 2008-02-28

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:12 pm

Bill wrote:
adauria wrote:
And when they push far enough, they shouldn't be surprised that people will find loopholes or even black or gray markets.

I am fully prepared to buy tobacco on the black market if and when it becomes available and will do so without the slightest shred of guilt.

You and me both, Bill.

-Andrew
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the macdonald

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Age : 42
Location : Windsor CT
Registration date : 2008-08-31

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Fri Mar 12, 2010 4:51 pm

adauria wrote:
Bill wrote:
adauria wrote:
And when they push far enough, they shouldn't be surprised that people will find loopholes or even black or gray markets.

I am fully prepared to buy tobacco on the black market if and when it becomes available and will do so without the slightest shred of guilt.

You and me both, Bill.

-Andrew

Pipe smoking as political action! I used to wear a motorcycle jacket, spikes and long hair to rebel, now I just smoke a pipe.
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MisterE
Moderator
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Location : Mexico City
Registration date : 2009-08-24

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Fri Mar 12, 2010 6:27 pm

While I tend to agree that us pipe smokers are getting our collective "bowls" reamed on this one, I am not optimistic about a favorable result. Unfortunately, as far as smoking is concerned we are considered second class citizens.
Could you imagine the uproar if all of a suddden they imposed a similar tax hike on, say, caffeinated beverages or fatty foods?? Could never pass. They could try, but obesity is not in the same politically incorrect league as smoking is, and the bill would be seen as ridiculous. Yes, itīs all bad for you. Lotsa fat wonīt do a heart much good, caffeine is quite addictive, and sugar, (well some of you might remember the Twinkie defense??) Itīs all under the guise of "weīre really helping you even you though you donīt know it."
My feeling is that the general thinking out there is "F--K īem, itīs bad for them so we can treat them however we want for doing it". Doesnīt have anything to do with whats "right", just what the pulic at large will let them get away with.
Sorry to be so pessimistic, but "justice" is subjective sometimes....
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phillpsych

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Age : 61
Location : Northern Illinois
Registration date : 2010-01-24

PostSubject: Re: An interesting exchange on Facebook   Wed Mar 17, 2010 7:28 pm

Civil Disobedience... I too will buy tobacco on the black market. All the more reason to stockpile while I can. I do not blame the politicians, however. They were "elected", and so behave as if they represent the people. They do not. They are doing what they do best, their business, maintaining personal power, and not the business of the people, maintaining freedom. Because the people are lemmings, and either don't care or don't know, and don't really want to know. The people believe what they are told to believe, and elect who they are brainwashed to elect. Freedom, in the United States, is a myth.
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