Dubbya-tee-eff, Brebbia?

Brothers of Briar

Help Support Brothers of Briar:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.

Kyle Weiss

Well-known member
Joined
Sep 18, 2011
Messages
11,988
Reaction score
7
So, I have this Brebbia 624 Golden Natural, got it back in...May/June I think...good price, unsmoked. Nice little bent bulldog. It's been an handful, though.

7611835472_43d9f3960d_c.jpg


The first issue was the (as I know it now) cheap vulcanite stem that was used. Upon two hours of painstaking shining and polishing, the sucker browned in five minutes--no kidding. It didn't go green, but just stays a bakers-chocolate brown (and gets kind of greenish at the bit when used). Okay, fine, whatever. I can deal with vulcanite, it feels good on the teeth and I don't hate the rubbery taste.

Brebbia was nice enough to chamfer or "trumpet" (as I call it) the tenon of the airway on the stem, but did so in a very counterproductive manner-- it still has a weird, sharp edge to the inner hole. Occasionally, it would smoke pretty wet and gurgle even under the best of smoking conditions and slow puffing, so I opted to go after it with a pocket knife to finish the chamfering job they started. It's a method I've done countless times, helping my Peterson pipes tremendously. It also benefits pipes that have the shank drilled deeper than the tenon can reach (making a gap that can condensate/make wet the smoke). I've gotten my approach and method down to a fine science (in my own head, anyway) where the tenon ends up having the shape kind of like...as mentioned...a trumpet bell. It isn't just a 45-degree angle, it curves gently from the hole to the outer edge. Seems to work pretty good, especially after sanding it down and doing my best to "port and polish."

Well, I discovered something weird. Brebbia, either just this pipe or all of them (this my first and only), uses an acrylic insert to make the tenon, and fits it to the vulcanite bit. Okay, cool, whatever...seems like a lot of work rather than just turning out a single-material stem. The pipe, after my careful treatment, STILL had some moisture problems. So I took a bright flashlight, and bore-checked the stem. I'll be damned if there wasn't a piss-poor fitting of the two materials inside, making a edged choke-point inside. So, after it with the micro files I went. Not an easy job, but I got it done.

Why the heck would they do this? :scratch: I fondly remember the thread where Sasquatch was talking about pipe engineering, and how drilling accuracy and airway care make a big difference in smoking, and I agree. This is a case where the engineering was a little careless, and the user had to make right the process oversights.

Speaking of which, what happened to Sas' challenge to take a notoriously bad smoking pipe and re-do the poor thing correctly to fix it? Did I miss that?

Anyway, that was my version of "airway fixing" of sorts. Just wondering if anyone else has had issues with newer Brebbias and if it's a common problem.

8)
 
I'm wondering if the original owner dropped the pipe and broke the tenon before he ever smoked it and had it repaired by someone who drilled the new tenon hole slightly off center. Are you sure the tenon isn't Delrin? This is a common replacement tenon material used by repair guys.

Rad
 
Brand-new pipe, Rad--should have clarified better. Sorry. :| Definitely from the factory like this...though the tenon "acrylic" I referred to was a bit softer than other acrylic I've treated in the same manner, so this "delrin" stuff might be what the insert is made from.

Is it possible the stem was broken in production and this is how they fix them before they're sent out?

(thanks for replying/posting, by the way)

8)
 
I think it was Marty Pulvers who once said of Savinelli, they make hundred dollar pipes with ten cent stems. Brebbia must get their stems from the same place. A lot of thought and engineering put into the outside of the pipe, guess they had nothing left in the budget for the inside.

 
I just looked at my only Brebbia. It seems to be the same way Kyle describes. Chamfered tenon, delrin, and a sloppy transition where the delrin is inserted into the acrylic material.

I don't smoke that Brebbia very often because of the issues it has, yet I don't feel like parting with it because it was given to me by a good friend who is now deceased. It does look very pretty though.

Kyle, I was wondering about Sas's pipe challenge just yesterday. What happened?
 
Ocelot55":k2bogc8p said:
Kyle, I was wondering about Sas's pipe challenge just yesterday. What happened?
No idea...hopefully this spurs an answer from him, I figured I just missed the boat thread. Again. :lol:

Ocelot, if you send that Brebbia and a few bucks for return shipping I could do for your pipe what I did for mine, if you'd like. It went from a pipe I looked at and frowned when I considered smoking it to grabbing it without hesitation. It isn't a hard thing to do, just takes some finesse--you're plenty skilled enough to do it, too, I'm guessing. Just smoothin' out the edges and reducing that "step" where the two materials were joined made a world of difference.

8)
 
Puff Daddy":iirw06d6 said:
Kyle, you should by a pre molded stem that is close in shape and dimension to that one and have a go at drilling it properly, and sanding it to fit.

http://www.pimopipecraft.com/square.html
My ability to really do much more than fix slight problems with underperforming pipes is limited by lack of equipment and even more so by space to do it right, but good idea. I would like nothing more than to get rid of this bad Vulcanite stem and have an acrylic one put on...but...more $$$ if I sent it to the place you sent that fatty 999 to...although it'd be worth it. If that were the case, I'd send my sentimental cheap Nording freehand (my first new pipe) over to have it worked on, too. I considered sending that one to Sas' challenge, because I just can't get the sucker to not gurgle like a drowning rat.

The 10-cent Brebbia stem is doing about as good as it can at the moment.

8)

 
Kyle Weiss":wfd711a4 said:
Ocelot, if you send that Brebbia and a few bucks for return shipping I could do for your pipe what I did for mine, if you'd like. It went from a pipe I looked at and frowned when I considered smoking it to grabbing it without hesitation. It isn't a hard thing to do, just takes some finesse--you're plenty skilled enough to do it, too, I'm guessing. Just smoothin' out the edges and reducing that "step" where the two materials were joined made a world of difference.

8)
Thanks for the offer Kyle. I have performed that procedure myself for a few estate pipes, so its no mystery to me. Others might like that service though. Maybe you should hang out your shingle as the Brebbia pipe repair man.
 
Kyle Weiss":t8qp7wq9 said:
Puff Daddy":t8qp7wq9 said:
Kyle, you should by a pre molded stem that is close in shape and dimension to that one and have a go at drilling it properly, and sanding it to fit.

http://www.pimopipecraft.com/square.html
My ability to really do much more than fix slight problems with underperforming pipes is limited by lack of equipment and even more so by space to do it right, but good idea. I would like nothing more than to get rid of this bad Vulcanite stem and have an acrylic one put on...but...more $$$ if I sent it to the place you sent that fatty 999 to...although it'd be worth it. If that were the case, I'd send my sentimental cheap Nording freehand (my first new pipe) over to have it worked on, too. I considered sending that one to Sas' challenge, because I just can't get the sucker to not gurgle like a drowning rat.

The 10-cent Brebbia stem is doing about as good as it can at the moment.

8)
Contact Tim Thorpe in NJ. He makes KILLER stems for replacements. While he's at it, have him open it up to a 4mm airway.

http://www.timthorpepipes.com/contact.html
 
Re-Stems :

When the subject of stems comes up, a debate between those who prefer one material or the other—Lucite or vulcanite—usually follows, but the issue never gets settled. Like two people who own exactly half of the properties in a Monopoly game, each has enough fans to keep the dispute going forever.

Shift the topic to the method of creation—carved versus molded—and it’s the other extreme: Virtually unanimous agreement that carved is superior. The perception is that they are sleeker, more comfortable (thinner through the bite zone), more elegant in contour, and better finished. Their being considered “better” is such a slam dunk, in fact, most smokers wouldn’t think twice if they had their choice for the same price when buying a pipe.

Like many things, however, concept is what is sold, but an example is what you buy. A carved stem doesn’t necessarily have the attributes listed above. In fact, because they are labor intensive to make, the same time consuming details that make them potentially superior are often the ones that get omitted or overlooked. Personally, I’d much rather have a well fitted and finished molded stem than a so-so carved one.

There is also a third, “hybrid” category that’s not frequently [2008] seen, and PSPR&R might be the only repair outfit currently making replacement stems in such a way, though it has doubtless been done before. It is taking a molded stem that’s larger in every dimension than the desired final result, and carving it like rod stock.

This approach captures the best of both worlds: complete control of the shape for the maker, and the economy of molded blanks for the customer. Are such stems still “hand carved?” Of course. Is the draft hole “frozen” at the size it is molded? No, it can be enlarged if desired, the same as any other stem. It’s an engineering axiom that all price vs. performance solutions involve trade-offs, however… so, what’s the downside in this case?

That is a good question, and the reason for this blog entry. There are none that I am aware of. I’ve heard for years that the actual material used in rod stock is of a higher quality than molded, but examples abound that run contrary to what one would expect if that were categorically the case. Further, there’s a correlation vs. causation variable that’s rarely considered: the more expensive the pipe, the more likely it is to have a rod cut stem and the more likely it is to be better cared for… and there’s no question that long term storage, routine maintenance, and post-smoke cleaning significantly affect a stem’s appearance and life expectancy, especially for vulcanite.

To help you decide the issue for yourself, at least with regard to shaping, here are some actual examples of “hybrid” stems . . .

(The Loewe stem is on a Yak pipe :D )

http://precisionpiperepair.com/BLOG/?p=5#more-5

Standard replacement - For those who prefer their pipe's stem refitted in the traditional, economical way, with a molded bit that is an approximation of the original. To fit these, the shank/stem junction is sanded smooth and level, and the shank re-finished.

Vulcanite - $20
Lucite - $24

Premium replacement - For smokers who want a stem that is equal to the fit and finish of higher-grade pipes. They are more slender through the bite zone, the button is more contoured, the level of polish higher, and overall precision greater than the Standard replacement.

These labor-intensive stems are completely hand carved from a blank that is oversized in every dimension (effectively rod stock). Shape is close to the original, but not necessarily exact.
Vulcanite - $50
Lucite - $54

Custom replacement - For smokers who want a Premium stem that is an unusual shape, is their own design, or which duplicates an original almost exactly.

Sketches and/or photos are often exchanged via email to assure exact execution of the customer's wishes.
$60 and up (contact for quote)

http://www.precisionpiperepair.com/stem.php
:cat: :face: :study:
 
I have a Brebbia Golden-Extra 623 which looks exactly like your pipe. I bought it new and it smoked like a champion from the word go.

Now that you've mentioned it, I can also see the "step" in the airway where the tenon stops but it does not bother me at all.

This is one of my favourite pipes and it just smokes better and better, the more I use it.
 
Yak":3hsbowb4 said:
Re-Stems :

When the subject of stems comes up, a debate between those who prefer one material or the other—Lucite or vulcanite—usually follows, but the issue never gets settled. Like two people who own exactly half of the properties in a Monopoly game, each has enough fans to keep the dispute going forever.

Shift the topic to the method of creation—carved versus molded—and it’s the other extreme: Virtually unanimous agreement that carved is superior. The perception is that they are sleeker, more comfortable (thinner through the bite zone), more elegant in contour, and better finished. Their being considered “better” is such a slam dunk, in fact, most smokers wouldn’t think twice if they had their choice for the same price when buying a pipe.

Like many things, however, concept is what is sold, but an example is what you buy. A carved stem doesn’t necessarily have the attributes listed above. In fact, because they are labor intensive to make, the same time consuming details that make them potentially superior are often the ones that get omitted or overlooked. Personally, I’d much rather have a well fitted and finished molded stem than a so-so carved one.

There is also a third, “hybrid” category that’s not frequently [2008] seen, and PSPR&R might be the only repair outfit currently making replacement stems in such a way, though it has doubtless been done before. It is taking a molded stem that’s larger in every dimension than the desired final result, and carving it like rod stock.

This approach captures the best of both worlds: complete control of the shape for the maker, and the economy of molded blanks for the customer. Are such stems still “hand carved?” Of course. Is the draft hole “frozen” at the size it is molded? No, it can be enlarged if desired, the same as any other stem. It’s an engineering axiom that all price vs. performance solutions involve trade-offs, however… so, what’s the downside in this case?

That is a good question, and the reason for this blog entry. There are none that I am aware of. I’ve heard for years that the actual material used in rod stock is of a higher quality than molded, but examples abound that run contrary to what one would expect if that were categorically the case. Further, there’s a correlation vs. causation variable that’s rarely considered: the more expensive the pipe, the more likely it is to have a rod cut stem and the more likely it is to be better cared for… and there’s no question that long term storage, routine maintenance, and post-smoke cleaning significantly affect a stem’s appearance and life expectancy, especially for vulcanite.

To help you decide the issue for yourself, at least with regard to shaping, here are some actual examples of “hybrid” stems . . .

(The Loewe stem is on a Yak pipe :D )

http://precisionpiperepair.com/BLOG/?p=5#more-5

Standard replacement - For those who prefer their pipe's stem refitted in the traditional, economical way, with a molded bit that is an approximation of the original. To fit these, the shank/stem junction is sanded smooth and level, and the shank re-finished.

Vulcanite - $20
Lucite - $24

Premium replacement - For smokers who want a stem that is equal to the fit and finish of higher-grade pipes. They are more slender through the bite zone, the button is more contoured, the level of polish higher, and overall precision greater than the Standard replacement.

These labor-intensive stems are completely hand carved from a blank that is oversized in every dimension (effectively rod stock). Shape is close to the original, but not necessarily exact.
Vulcanite - $50
Lucite - $54

Custom replacement - For smokers who want a Premium stem that is an unusual shape, is their own design, or which duplicates an original almost exactly.

Sketches and/or photos are often exchanged via email to assure exact execution of the customer's wishes.
$60 and up (contact for quote)

http://www.precisionpiperepair.com/stem.php
:cat: :face: :study:
Glad he worked out for you yak. He did not check his pms, return multiple phone messages, or multiple emails.

NOT a viable option unless something has changed.
 
For those of you who are "skimmers" rather than readers, I think I'm good. My question lay in wondering if all Brebbia stems end up like this or not, really. I have fixed 90% of the problem with this pipe and stem, the other 10% made up for by adapting smoking approach a little. For example, this would not be a good "social" pipe, as I get anxiety and puff fast and randomly. This would not be a good rainy-day pipe. It would not be good for SG blends right out of the tin.

I could easily spend hundreds and hundreds of dollars for all of the stem replacements I've considered, depending on how picky I want to be. It'd be cheaper and more advantageous to sell the damn pipe had I failed, honestly...so I do the best I can with what I have. Except that cheap, sentimental Nording I referred to above--the bugger is hopeless in my hands. If that pipe were to go to Sasquatch for a "have at it" to rescue it, I'd be obliged. It was the first new pipe I ever bought, and it was before I knew how to check a pipe for possible pitfalls--I just like how it sat and the color. I still do.

8)

 
Kyle Weiss":pd6mp20y said:
Brand-new pipe, Rad--should have clarified better. Sorry. :| Definitely from the factory like this...though the tenon "acrylic" I referred to was a bit softer than other acrylic I've treated in the same manner, so this "delrin" stuff might be what the insert is made from.

Is it possible the stem was broken in production and this is how they fix them before they're sent out?

(thanks for replying/posting, by the way)

8)
Delrin is actually preferred by some pipe makers for it's slick almost self lubricating characteristics. There are a few other qualities to it that I can't recall at the moment. It comes in pre-sized rounds, so all you have to do is cut it to length, drill it and insert it in your stem. As long as you have the right drill bit for it, you get a perfect fit every time.

Certainly not my preference though. It just doesn't seem natural, for the lack of a better word. I'll wave the banner for integrated tenons!!!

 
So... perfect-fitting stem made of a multi-step and multi-material process (it can't be cheaper this way...) in lieu of the potential of a screwy airway? :scratch: Seems odd to me. Plausible, but nonsensical. I wouldn't be making pipes that way, either.

8)
 
@ Brother Kyle

I have a "new generation" bent Parker which gurgled so badly that I hardly smoked it at all.

Some time ago, I started "trumpeting" all my pipestems which are suitable for the operation. Said Parker benefitted a lot but still gurgled a bit with moist tobacco.

Today I tried your method and opened up the "trumpet" completely. I filled the bowl with BR Gold which is fresh and quite moist. And the miracle happened!! No more gurgling like in NO MORE gurgling. I even tried some heavy puffing and.....no gurgle :D

I thank you, my brother, for sharing your experience here. :cheers:
 
Kyle Weiss":02crw999 said:
Brand-new pipe, Rad--should have clarified better. Sorry. :| Definitely from the factory like this...though the tenon "acrylic" I referred to was a bit softer than other acrylic I've treated in the same manner, so this "delrin" stuff might be what the insert is made from.

Is it possible the stem was broken in production and this is how they fix them before they're sent out?

(thanks for replying/posting, by the way)

8)
Sounds like Delrin if it seems softer. Maybe they use Delrin tenons. Like Brian says, many makers do.

There really is no excuse for a step up or down or the tenon being off center, if they doing this on a lathe (and I can't imagine they're not), unless they're drilling different size holes in the tenon vs the stem. If they're doing that, they shouldn't. :)

Rad
 
Speedy: Neat. :cheers: Glad it worked for ya!

Rad: I'm pretty sure it's delrin, now that I know what that is, exactly. :lol: I also think they pre-drilled the airway in the vulcanite stem and delrin tenon separately and then matched them up later... they weren't off-center to each other (thank goodness) but the width was probably 1mm different between the two. Very strange.

The airway in the entire stem still isn't perfect (I hear a whistle now) but the condensation problems are fixed. Not a big deal, it'll serve as a reminder to slow down when I hear the whistle and I'm not paying attention, talking with people. :lol:

I'm not opposed to fixing pipes that had details overlooked at the time of manufacture, but then again, I'd rather have ugly briar that tasted good if I knew the internals were all right where they should be--at least at my spending level. I know it can be done, Todd Harris gives me beauty as well as astonishing function...so does Peterson.

8)
 
Top