Proposed Template for Narrative Reviews of Pipe Tobaccos

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Kapnismologist

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Gentlemen,

For various reasons, as of late I have found myself preparing numerous narrative reviews of various and sundry pipe tobaccos. This has got me thinking about issues concerning the form and structure of reviews which are actually helpful to others trying to decide on weather or not to drop the coin to try a particular blend. As you all well know, many reviews on TR are useless in this regard and it is only on discussion boards like this where one can get 'the real poop'.

After wading through many a review on TR and elsewhere (including here - helpful reviews all!), I decided to draft up a potential template for such reviews in the hope that it will not only help to structure my own approach to writing them but also perhaps be useful to others as well. My overall idea was to formalize a structure which I have been using for a time now (which is based ultimately on the reviews of folks much more knowledgeable than myself in such matters which I have benefited from previously) in the hopes that it will produce some good.

As such, I wanted to post the draft here for any comments, suggestions, revisions, emendations, etc. any of you might have should you feel so inclined. I am thinking an 'example' mock review to append to this template might be helpful as well? In any event, should you be interested ...

Proposed Template for Narrative Reviews of Pipe Tobaccos

Appearance: Describe how the tobacco looks. How is it cut (i.e., ribbon, shag, flake, broken flake, ready rubbed, spun, crumble cake, sliced, etc.)? What is the primary color of the tobacco? What are its secondary colors?

Tin Nose: Describe how the tobacco smells before it is prepared for smoking.

Presentation: Describe how the tobacco feels. Is it moist or is it dry? Is it springy, rubbery, thick, crumbly, stringy, etc. How does it pack? Does it require special preparation such as rubbing, cutting, cubing, folding, breaking, or crumbling? What type of preparation or packing method(s) did you find to be best suited to preparing the tobacco?

Flammability: Once prepared, how easily does the tobacco take to the flame? Does it require multiple initial lights beyond a false (charring) light and a true light? Does it typically require relights while smoking, or is an ember easy established and maintained?

Smoking Characteristics – Initial: As with fine wines, spirits, cigars, coffees, teas and other such carefully processed agricultural products, it is often helpful to approach a review of fine pipe tobacco with an attitude that the blend or mixture under review is like a particular dish which has been prepared with specific ingredients according to a specific recipe which has been created to produce particular aromas, flavors, textures, and taste sensations which should please the one who consumes it. Keeping this in mind, first reflect upon how the tobacco initially presents itself in the bowl? Would you describe it as stout, bright, rich, mild, strong, etc.?

Smoking Characteristics – Palate: As the bowl is smoked, what flavors and aromas do you notice in both the primary smoke stream and the side stream? Describing these flavors and aromas can seem difficult at first, but begin by thinking of the basic taste categories we all share by virtue of our physiology: sweet, salty, sour, bitter, and savory. Do any of these apply to the tobacco you are smoking? Second, think about exactly what type(s) of ‘sweet’, ‘salty’, ‘sour’, ‘bitter’, or ‘savory’ you detect in the tobacco and make comparisons to tastes and aromas you are familiar with (e.g., wood smoke, sawdust, mushrooms, leather, dark chocolate, roasted nuts, citrus, tea, etc., etc. – the list is endless and every reviewer will develop his own comparative lexicon). Is the sweetness fruit-like? If so, what kind of fruit? Is the bitterness earthy like, say, dark roasted coffee or nutty like, say, raw almonds?

Smoking Characteristics – Analysis: Do certain flavors persist over others, or do they come and go or change as the bowl progresses? What are the low flavors and what are the high flavors? Comment upon the characteristics of the each individual ingredient present in the tobacco you are reviewing (i.e., Virginias, Orientals, Perique, Burley, Latakia, etc.). Does any particular ingredient stand out? If so, in what way(s)? Do you think the various ingredients go well together? If so, how and why? Are the ingredients of the blend or mixture balanced, complementary, clashing, or muddled? In what way(s) exactly? It is very helpful here to think about what might happen if one or more of the ingredients were removed from the blend. How do you think it would taste then?

Smoking Characteristics – Finish: Does the tobacco bite? Is it a ‘sipper’ or a ‘puffer’? Is the nicotine content or room note worth noting? How would you describe its body? Is it mild, medium, or full bodied? How would you describe its finish (i.e., aftertaste)? Is it short, long, dry, rich, spicy, bitter, etc.? What type of dottle or ash does it leave behind?

Evaluation: Overall, how would you rate this tobacco? How does it compare to others of the same genre? Would you recommend it to others? Why or why not? Is it a potential ‘everyday blend’ or not? Do you think it would be a good candidate for long term cellaring (aging)? Why or why not? Also, here is the place to provide any relevant information on the sample upon which the review is based (i.e., “this was a five-year-old tin”, “this was the bulk version”, etc.) as well as any witty commentary one might want to include about packaging, presentation, marketing, and such like if so inclined.
 
Excellent form! Take a gander at my reviews on tobaccoreviews.com (I post under the same handle there of kilted1) They follow nearly that exact format 8)

I generated my own similar template for the very reasons of consistency in reviews, my mind is too old and full of other things to try to remember to cover all points in the 'heat' of a review. I think a template should serve to encourage those who wish to review, but don't really know where to begin.

Three big cheers for this proposal :cheers: :cheers: :cheers:
 
kilted1":equcoh72 said:
Take a gander at my reviews on tobaccoreviews.com (I post under the same handle there of kilted1) They follow nearly that exact format
Yep, now that I think about it (and spot check some of your 42 reviews there), indeed your methodology is absolutely one of the sources of inspiration (learning, really) for my own thoughts on the matter. I really have found useful the "lighting - mid bowl - home stretch" organization which you employ for the main body of the reviews, and have tried to think in those terms myself for some time now (I have noticed others doing it as well). From reading informative reviews like yours there I have, over time I suppose, internalized at least a few good habits!
 
Thanks, I'm one who really needs to improve on ones reviews & had been pondering this issue.
 
very good! my reviews always descend into prose! i'll try to employ your methodology in the future, but I make no promises! lol!
 
Several years ago, another pipe smoker (who shall remain nameless) and myself were considering starting an alternative tobacco review site structured this very way, eliminating a * based rating system, requiring these items in a structured form for the review, and a structured profile for each member. The review would populate the reviewer's top 5 tobacco blends, and top 5 frequently smoked blends (they are not always the same thing) as a point of reference for those reading the review. There would be latitude for free-form review within the required fields, but if all required fields were incomplete the review wouldn't post. The idea was to have consistent criterion for reviews, and a point of reference understanding something of the reviewers preferences.

I've always loved the reviews from folks who say they are a frequent 'English smoker' who is now trying out a VA flake and can't taste anything, then go about saying how it falls so short of Dunhill 965 or some such mess. My other favorites are the 4 or 5 line 'reviews' saying that "This blend tastes like crap wrapped in an old sock. It fried my tongue and ghosted my pipe beyond repair"

Both of us had life get in the way of finishing up the project and launching it, but it's been a back burner idea of mine for about 5 years or so.
 
Sure, take all the personality and individuality out of another enjoyable aspect of life.

Sorry, but I'll pass and fervently hope that others keep reviewing in their own personal style and form. There are many old timers there who I enjoy reading and really appreciate the great varieties. SOme do, some don't

Two thumbs down on any mandate for homogeneity and conformity. One could start their own site and dictate form, format as well as prescribe the proper mind set.


Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils.
 
Hmmm... I'm 50/50 about it. I certainly think a good review should include everything you mention. And I like to read reviews done that way (a timeline of the smoke, really). At the same time, a "free form" review can get to be almost poetic, with transendental truths being revealed by the smoker's reverie...

But for most reviews of most tobaccos, I think the "lab report" approach is probably the most helpful to other smokers, and that's the point, so I'm in. :cheers:
 
vaperfavour":q8mzbc2x said:
very good! my reviews always descend into prose! i'll try to employ your methodology in the future, but I make no promises! lol!
Many thanks for your vote of confidence here. In a certain sense, I think the idea of such a template is simply to systematically delineate a range of elements which *may* be result in the production of information useful to others (who might be interested in issues of nuance and such like in the first place, of course). As kilted1 said, quite wisely if my own limited experience in such matters is any indication, many elements get lost in the "heat" of a review.

The whole idea of such a template is very much one of an 'ideal type' (i.e., a maximum outline of what is *possible* or *desirable* for certain predetermined ends) - it never exists actually in reality, but rather only particular features of it do.

In any event, if you happen to think of any new elements to add, or to revise or reposition here, I would love to hear it.

Cheers!
 
kilted1":mev42p0v said:
Several years ago, another pipe smoker (who shall remain nameless) and myself were considering starting an alternative tobacco review site structured this very way, eliminating a * based rating system, requiring these items in a structured form for the review, and a structured profile for each member ... Both of us had life get in the way of finishing up the project and launching it, but it's been a back burner idea of mine for about 5 years or so.
An ambitious project to say the least, but one which I for one would most certainly be interested in. The more sources of such information available the better. Jon's site is, of course, indispensable for all of us and I am sure that each of us already well know whose reviews to pay attention to and whose to ignore (or, what type of reviews to take seriously and which to take 'cum grano salis'). If only I had the time to help with such a project - perhaps some day (life way too much in the way right now, brother, I know what you mean!).
 
Sasquatch":r0y4q5db said:
Hmmm... I'm 50/50 about it. I certainly think a good review should include everything you mention. And I like to read reviews done that way (a timeline of the smoke, really). At the same time, a "free form" review can get to be almost poetic, with transendental truths being revealed by the smoker's reverie...

But for most reviews of most tobaccos, I think the "lab report" approach is probably the most helpful to other smokers, and that's the point, so I'm in. :cheers:
Absolutely, both (and perhaps other types as well) are great. The best of both worlds, I suppose, would be to have access to, say, a few 'systematic' reviews alongside a few 'free form / poetic' reviews for the same smoking mixture under review. Sometimes we get that on TR (and elsewhere) for popular blends, and it furnishes a much more expansive picture than either/or alone.

Anyway, again if you have any elements to add, revise, etc. - please do post them. I really do want to try to develop this template a bit further as time allows.

Cheers!
 
Kapnismologist":nnyvdlwo said:
As you all well know, many reviews on TR are useless in this regard and it is only on discussion boards like this where one can get 'the real poop'.
Well, since Jon is adding forums to TR, that point might be moot. I find TR as a whole far from as useless as you.

Kapnismologist":nnyvdlwo said:
......Jon's site is, of course, indispensable for all of us and I am sure that each of us already well know whose reviews to pay attention to and whose to ignore ....
Yes, it is apparent who should be ignored both at TR and elsewhere.

Jon's site is, of course, Jon's to control and mange. Perhaps you could involve him in your grand self-promotion of your preferred format for reviews on his site.
 
Pleckzepiper":dqs4mgjw said:
Sure, take all the personality and individuality out of another enjoyable aspect of life.

Sorry, but I'll pass and fervently hope that others keep reviewing in their own personal style and form. There are many old timers there who I enjoy reading and really appreciate the great varieties. SOme do, some don't

Two thumbs down on any mandate for homogeneity and conformity. One could start their own site and dictate form, format as well as prescribe the proper mind set.


Live free or die: Death is not the worst of evils.
I don't think anything proposed here is a mandate, Kapnismologist and I got into a discussion, but I see no mandate anywhere.

For my part, it's still a back burner item, and I never sought to take anything away from anyone else's site.

For the record, I have and spend a great deal of time on ASP chat on undernet IRC channel (where I'm also a moderator) and have discussed tobacco reviews in general many times, to a surprising number of folks. Many people would LOVE to review that don't, they most often express that they don't know where to begin, or how to write a review. Having template(s) to use often helps them get started, helping them give form and expression to their thoughts. Others don't seem to have a clue about how to go about analyzing a bowl of even their favorite tobacco, let alone something they have just picked up.

I don't think in THIS forum a template should be mandatory, only an 'outline' for those who wish to submit reviews, would like to 'improve' their form or simply don't know where to begin.

I don't believe that either Kapnismologist or myself had any ideas of 'grand self promotion' or mandates. I know I certainly don't.
 
kilted1":hsfvgfn3 said:
don't think anything proposed here is a mandate, Kapnismologist and I got into a discussion, but I see no mandate anywhere.
Of course there is nothing of the sort, and the whole idea is just that of a suggestion (in the form of a discussion) regarding one of our shared favorite things in the world: smoking tobaccos and our collective knowledge of them. Personally, I do not have many pipe smoking friends who I can chat with on a regular basis in person, and so really look forward to spending time on this site reading, discussing, learning, and offering some of my own thoughts on various matters related to pipes and tobaccos. I have no agenda other than to enjoy myself and relax a bit (while smoking a pipe, of course) by interacting with the incredible group we have here.

We all have our individual opinions and ideas, and none is more *right* or *correct* then any others. We have ideas, we learn more, we change our ideas, and improve ourselves. No harm, no foul. One thing which is so great about this forum is that those who post regularly are such great, warm, and supportive folks who love to discuss, and sometimes debate, our shared passion.

When the day is done, we should always recall that we are, above all else, 'brothers of the briar'. Now, can we get back to discussing tobacco ...
 
kilted1":gs9g0kmg said:
I don't think anything proposed here is a mandate, Kapnismologist and I got into a discussion, but I see no mandate anywhere.


I don't believe that either Kapnismologist or myself had any ideas of 'grand self promotion' or mandates. I know I certainly don't.

My overall idea was to formalize a structure which I have been using for a time now....
I read this as such, as well as an intrusion into another site and its operations. TR has a means to make such recommendations to the persons in position to make such decisions and implement what they see as useful. This whole thread strikes me as somewhat subversive in nature. Perhaps Jon will view it otherwise once he reviews the thread himself.

I've a strong aversion to discussions on one internet site about another site. Especially if appearing has done behind the back, as it were. Such formalization smacks of pretentious behavior that pipe smoking and smokers need not adopt. PIpe smokers are individuals and that is a most endearing quality in this age of lock-step conformist and "correct" society.

My opinion, no more valuable than any other's. Opinions were solicited, and I have rendered mine. Be well!
 
Pleckzepiper":w74sp3ql said:
kilted1":w74sp3ql said:
I don't think anything proposed here is a mandate, Kapnismologist and I got into a discussion, but I see no mandate anywhere.


I don't believe that either Kapnismologist or myself had any ideas of 'grand self promotion' or mandates. I know I certainly don't.

My overall idea was to formalize a structure which I have been using for a time now....
I read this as such, as well as an intrusion into another site and its operations. TR has a means to make such recommendations to the persons in position to make such decisions and implement what they see as useful. This whole thread strikes me as somewhat subversive in nature. Perhaps Jon will view it otherwise once he reviews the thread himself.

I've a strong aversion to discussions on one internet site about another site. Especially if appearing has done behind the back, as it were. Such formalization smacks of pretentious behavior that pipe smoking and smokers need not adopt. PIpe smokers are individuals and that is a most endearing quality in this age of lock-step conformist and "correct" society.

My opinion, no more valuable than any other's. Opinions were solicited, and I have rendered mine. Be well!
I guess by that reasoning, everyone should drive a FORD!

What Pipe Forum is the oldest? We should all participate only there!

My ONLY mention of TR was in my first response and that I had reviews there.

I discussed having considered (with the help of a fellow enthusiast) creating another site and the criterion we were considering and why. There are in fact several places where there are reviews of tobacco and pipe related products. Does simply mentioning them here equate to subversion? Who am I supposed to be subverting?

I'm not overthrowing anyone, or forcing conformity or snobbery or anything else. If anything, an optional (in this case) template(s) might serve to engage more participation in an even deeper understanding of our hobby, and encourage some folks to participate in a (for them) deeper way. I'm absolutely baffled as to how this threatens anyone or subverts TR or anyone else's work.

You seem to have trouble taking me at my word, so be it.

Be well!
 
I think the idea is that by formalizing a review, you may just be able to avoid the type of review that you find once in awhile. I'll paste one here:

Absolutely WRETCHED!! Not worth writing about & into the TRASH CAN!

That's the whole review. It's a review of Old Dublin, by Peterson, a tobacco with some interesting elements, notably a high basma content, yielding a medium english with some real character. Is it for everyone? Certainly not. But a totally uneducated review, offering a bash, no info (other than the reviewer did not like it, but that's not "info about a tobacco" that's "info about a reviewer").

Contrast that with a review like this:

A good middle of the road English Tobacco. Opening the tin reveals high quality ready to smoke tobacco with no stems to be found. The moisture content seemed fine even at first but I found it is easier to light as you progress through a tin so maybe a little drying right at the start, while not necessary, might not hurt.
The aroma of the tobacco itself is smokey with nutty overtones and is quite pleasant.

I found this to smoke cool and evenly to the end with no bite at all. Good smokey latakia taste but without the pine overtones or sour tang that I find in MM965. Nothing too distinctive but also nothing to offend or to have to get used to.

This tobacco has currently become my "go to" tobacco when I want something a bit stronger in nicotine and with no bite, generally towards the end of the day. The fact that the taste is not overly strong or fancy makes for a nice relaxing, non- distracting smoke.

------------------

Bottom Line: A good solid English Blend; pleasant smokey flavor but without the sour tang seen in My Mixture 965, nothing exciting and so perfect for the times when you are not looking for exciting


Both reviews lifted (I hope legally?) from tobaccoreviews.com

Never mind that one is positive and one negative. A review of 4 stars and the line "Fantastic, a superior tobacco that everyone should try" is equally useless. One contains actual info about the tobacco, the other doesn't.

So are we interested in "objectifying" the tobacco review? Somewhat, but the fact remains that the only tool in "testing" pipe tobacco is the poor old subjective human being.

I find "objectified" reviews more useful, so I support the proposed protocol. I can still be creative and poetic inside that skeleton.

Anyone who does NOT want to use the format is welcome not to.

As for the subversion of another website... well, we all use and love tobaccoreviews, but let's face it, some reviews and some reviewers need to be held as being "more worthwhile" than others.

"Uh, Hi, I'm Todd, this is my first review. I've been smoking pipes for 2 weeks now. I'm going to review Penzance. It's gross and smells funny, and should be avoided."

Oh gawd.

Perhaps what I'm really saying is that reviewers should make an effort to understand the tobacco they are reviewing, and having to actually think about all sorts of different aspects, cut, color, moisture, tin note, etc, it will actually force the quality of the reviews up?

Or maybe I'm just a snob... :flower:
 
This is getting surprisingly strange and unproductive due to a slight misinterpretation of my original post.

So, in the interest of allowing us to get back on track, please allow me be as clear as possible here:

I have posted a few and some reviews on TR and elsewhere, and in developing my own relationship with what I feel it means to experience a particular pipe tobacco over that time, I was inspired by many, many reviewers and reviews - the language, style, scope, and various methods of putting into words a particular individual experience. The whole purpose of doing this was to help my own thinking and to share something with others which may, hopefully, be useful.

Over the course of doing such reviews, I began to internalize a certain structure, language, and such like. Just recently, I decided to write up - that is to say FORMALIZE - this into a template. I posted this template here for comments and suggestions to help me improve it and to share the fruits of my experience, which may or may not be useful, with those who might want to write reviews themselves.

An important aspect of my inspiration to do this was my frustration, again and again, in finding the type of information I look for in a particular tobacco in the reviews on TR. It is an important site, but at the same time it is what it is. I celebrate it for its usefulness, as many I think do. It would, in fact, be just peaches if we had TR plus another site like the one kilted1 describes plus yet another review site plus yet another (and perhaps yet one more). Why is that? Because it is possible. One the most profound aspects of the internet, for our purposes and others, is that is democratizes knowledge. It allows us to have access to a wealth of information unimaginable until this most recent of recent blips in human history. It also allows us, nay requires us as global citizens, to contribute in meaningful ways to that process.

This is all I am going to say on the matter. If some still do not understand the whole point of this thread, that is just fine with me.

Cheers!
 
Sasquatch":033njca8 said:
I think the idea is that by formalizing a review, you may just be able to avoid the type of review that you find once in awhile. I'll paste one here ... Or maybe I'm just a snob... :flower:
And an informed one at that! You explained it with more oomph than I could ever hope to.
 
Used as a guide, I think a structured format is a good idea for reviews,,,gives you a guide so you can't miss an important aspect someone might find important,,,however on the flip side I enjoy the poetry and enthusiasm (positive or negative) of artistic views,,,one comes to mind,,,a comment mid-review of Hal o the Wynd,in Tobacco reviews,,,,,,,," I think it smells like a bumble bee fart ",,,,,,,,,,a priceless and descriptive image that still brings a smile to my face,,,( Patrick McManus would be proud ),,,,,some reviewers let their character shine through, and although that may provide a little less information, it makes for a more interesting read,,,
 
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