Red, Bright, Maryland, Kentucky, etc: What does it all mean?

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gilgawulf

gilgawulf

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I've smoked so many tobaccos that are listed as having 'red virginia', or 'lemon virginia', or various other types of virginias. I've smoked dark fired Kentucky (is there any other type?) I'm pretty sure I've smoked something with Maryland in it. What do all these names mean? What are the defining characteristics of these different types. And what about orientals? What's the difference between turkish and oriental? And what about Basma, Macedonian, etc. ? Lastly, what makes brown cavendish different from black or gold cavendish?
Any and all wide and sundry details about this matter would be greatly appreciated.

--edit: while we're on the subject, are Maryland and Kentucky burley or virginia tobaccos? Or are they something else entirely? What other sub-groupings are there? And what the heck is this 'green river' stuff I've seen in some of the Altadis aromatics?
 
The Pipes and Cigars web site was helpful but my specific question that led me to this thread is, are Kentucky and Burley somewhat interchangeable names? In other words, if a tobacco blend lists Kentucky as one of the ingredients does it contain a Burley?
 
Short answer: 'Kentucky' is a kind of Burley. So...Kentucky is always Burley...but Burley is not always Kentucky. Meaning...there are a fair number of Burley tobaccos...of which Kentucky is one.
 
Is this a good time to ask if Kentucky can also be a "White Burley?" Or are hand grenades going to start being thrown, sans the pins and levers? :lol:
 
White burley IS grown in Kentucky. So is Green River Burley.
But Kentucky is a smoked burley grown in Kentucky and Tennessee
 
Sometimes my browser has a fit when I try and edit posts, and it ended up doubling the post, and then PB added something, so I couldn't delete it, so... yeah. Sorry.

I've read some discussions about the which-Burley-is-what-and-from-where situation and thought maybe it was one of those kinds of discussions, you know, olive oil on the pipe, what's an English/Balkan and why, how many matches should I be using to smoke... etc. You know, grenades. 8)

Maybe I'm wrong. Maybe I need a real grenade. :D
 
Blackhorse":um0cbkg7 said:
Short answer: 'Kentucky' is a kind of Burley. So...Kentucky is always Burley...but Burley is not always Kentucky. Meaning...there are a fair number of Burley tobaccos...of which Kentucky is one.
Click to expand...

Multiple choice based on above passage (3 mins):

Are there a fair number of Burleys in Kentucky?

a) There is only one

b) There is not always Burley in Kentucky

c) Kentucky is always Burley

d) N/A not enough information

Which is the more complete answer?

a) Kentucky

b) Burley

c) Both are the same

d) Neither

Kentucky is to Burley as:

a) California is to activism

b) Potatoes are to French fries

c) There is only one Kentucky Burley

d) N/A not enough information
 
You guys are pleasantly off the deep end tonight.

Tobacco is actually, formally, known by it's curing technique. OK?
But some also have familiar names example:
Virginia is flue cured and flue cured is Virginia. Period.
If one grows a strain of tobacco that is intended to be flue cured and air cures it then it's not Virginia.
There is no air cured Virginia. OK?

Air cured can be Maryland or a Burley eg White Burley or Dark Burley (which is Kentucky actually).
Fire cured dark Burley is often called fire cured Kentucky.
 
Rusty":k8so1m9u said:
You guys are pleasantly off the deep end tonight.

Tobacco is actually, formally, known by it's curing technique. OK?
But some also have familiar names example:
Virginia is flue cured and flue cured is Virginia. Period.
If one grows a strain of tobacco that is intended to be flue cured and air cures it then it's not Virginia.
There is no air cured Virginia. OK?

Air cured can be Maryland or a Burley eg White Burley or Dark Burley (which is Kentucky actually).
Fire cured dark Burley is often called fire cured Kentucky.
Click to expand...

Whaaaat? Really? Plant varietal notwithstanding?

Reading/citation references! :D
 
Kyle Weiss":mbglb418 said:
Rusty":mbglb418 said:
You guys are pleasantly off the deep end tonight.

Tobacco is actually, formally, known by it's curing technique. OK?
But some also have familiar names example:
Virginia is flue cured and flue cured is Virginia. Period.
If one grows a strain of tobacco that is intended to be flue cured and air cures it then it's not Virginia.
There is no air cured Virginia. OK?

Air cured can be Maryland or a Burley eg White Burley or Dark Burley (which is Kentucky actually).
Fire cured dark Burley is often called fire cured Kentucky.
Click to expand...

Whaaaat? Really? Plant varietal notwithstanding?

Reading/citation references! :D
Click to expand...
Burley is actually a derivative of the plant we now call Virginia (when it's flue cured).
Varietals are intended for specific curing techniques. So White Burley looks different than dark Burley.
http://www.tobaccoleaf.org/conteudos/default.asp?id=18

Quote: "Growers have developed a wide range of morphologically different types, from the small-leaved aromatic tobaccos to the large, broad-leaved cigar tobaccos. Yet, each type of tobacco is generally defined by the curing method applied to it."

But they are all variations on Nicotiana Tabacum.
 
Rusty, the "Virginia is flue cured and flue cured is Virginia. Period." doesn't seem quite right.

http://www.tobacconistuniversity.org/tobacco-college/pipe-varietal-families1.asp


Even there, and in your link, it says most of the tobacco is treated in a particular way due to name or varietal, but flue-curing doesn't make a Burley a Virginia, nor does air-curing make a Virginia a Burley. Granted, there's probably some confusion as to what is what, but there's varietal offshoots of a common plant, making them--different plants.

Maybe there's also some older classification/purity system truth to this, but from all I've read so far, treatment of the tobacco doesn't change what it is as a varietal.
 
Kyle Weiss":rovfdnky said:
Rusty, the "Virginia is flue cured and flue cured is Virginia. Period." doesn't seem quite right.

http://www.tobacconistuniversity.org/tobacco-college/pipe-varietal-families1.asp


Even there, and in your link, it says most of the tobacco is treated in a particular way due to name or varietal, but flue-curing doesn't make a Burley a Virginia, nor does air-curing make a Virginia a Burley. Granted, there's probably some confusion as to what is what, but there's varietal offshoots of a common plant, making them--different plants.

Maybe there's also some older classification/purity system truth to this, but from all I've read so far, treatment of the tobacco doesn't change what it is as a varietal.
Click to expand...
Go check USDA site if you want. They define all the tobacco types and they connect it to curing technique.
The site you referenced is a bit soft. Virginia is a familiar name for flue cured, bright, etc. There is no room for 'typically' flue cured. Virginia is a familiar name for flue cured. That's all. It's not a name for a seed type.

In the US the USDA has classes for Virginia and they are types 11a, 11b, 12, 13, & 14 and these correspond to the geographical belts in VA/NC/SC & GA/FL. They are all flue cured.

11a is Old Belt, 11b is Middle Belt, 12 is Eastern Belt....
 
Pardon me. (hopefully a real mod will see this and spank me)

OH F#CK!!! Your actually appealing to a branch of State as a definitive information source.
 
puros_bran":68m7meyc said:
Pardon me. (hopefully a real mod will see this and spank me)

OH F#CK!!! Your actually appealing to a branch of State as a definitive information source.
Click to expand...
Kyle has all these wrong ideas. I'm slowly killing off all the myths. But he does resist. He likes to get it wrong and complicate it the first couple of times. I'd refer him to God if I was speaking terms.

I wish he would read the books that he owns.
 
Kyle Weiss":2df0f7mp said:
I still don't buy that cure = varietal. I just don't. Sorry, Rusty.
Click to expand...
What is your net worth?

It's not cure = varietal. Because otherwise white burley would be identical to dark burley. Both are air cured. The varietal are plants seeds and there a ton of them. They have all sorts of nice and poor characteristics. And there have been new ones for years and years.

The tobacco type is associated with curing technique. That is the way it is defined. The names we know are associated always with curing technique.
 
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