Balkan style

[desertpiper]

I'm currently smoking G.L. Pease Charing Cross, and I'm really liking it. It says on the label that it's a traditional Balkan style tobacco. So what other Balkan style tobacco's are there out there? I'm not even really shore what Balkan style means.

 

[monbla256]

Most "Balkan" style blends/mixtures are basicaly an "English" style of tobacco with a base of Virginia's and USUALLY NO Latakia. It uses other Oriental tobacco's such as Ynidje and others as the sharper flavoring agent. They also do NOT have any Perique ( in the true British style Balkan) in them. They were in a way,defined years ago by the Balkan Sobranie 759 blend (in the black/gold tin) and it was a FANTASTIC tasting blend/mixture ! ( I smoked it for almost 20 years and still have a few tins left from the early 80s.) Today, there are two blends/mixtures that I can say replicate the old 759 which I smoke on a regular daily basis: Peretti's Royal Blend and McClellands Oriental #14, both of which I HIGHLY RECOMEND (once again, JMHO )
(an additional note: the original British Balkan blends/mixture did NOT have any Burley in them either, just different varieties of Virginias as a base with the various Orientals as the "condiment" tobacco. From my experience and opinion, I would not consider a blend/mixture with Burley in it a Balkan no matter who makes it JMHO )

 

[glpease]

Most "Balkan" style blends/mixtures are basicaly an "English" style of tobacco with a base of Virginia's and USUALLY NO Latakia. It uses other Oriental tobacco's such as Ynidje and others as the sharper flavoring agent. They also do NOT have any Perique ( in the true British style Balkan) in them. They were in a way,defined years ago by the Balkan Sobranie 759 blend (in the black/gold tin) and it was a FANTASTIC tasting blend/mixture ! ( I smoked it for almost 20 years and still have a few tins left from the early 80s.) Today, there are two blends/mixtures that I can say replicate the old 759 which I smoke on a regular daily basis: Peretti's Royal Blend and McClellands Oriental #14, both of which I HIGHLY RECOMEND (once again, JMHO )
(an additional note: the original British Balkan blends/mixture did NOT have any Burley in them either, just different varieties of Virginias as a base with the various Orientals as the "condiment" tobacco. From my experience and opinion, I would not consider a blend/mixture with Burley in it a Balkan no matter who makes it JMHO )

No Latakia?

I'm as guilty as the next guy of propagating the whole "Balkan vs. English" thing, but I've recanted, and feel the distinction between them is more illusory than factual. But, without question, any tobacco that bears the word Balkan on its label most certainly does contain Latakia, and generally in abundance. Balkan Sobranie, originally, arguably the quintessence of what we would currently refer to as a "balkan style" contained about 50% of the stuff, and the 759 originally had about 60% Latakia.

I've written it all down already, so I'll just refer the interested to the article...

(As an aside, when I finish the label redesigns, the term will disappear from them.)

 

[monbla256]

Most "Balkan" style blends/mixtures are basicaly an "English" style of tobacco with a base of Virginia's and USUALLY NO Latakia. It uses other Oriental tobacco's such as Ynidje and others as the sharper flavoring agent. They also do NOT have any Perique ( in the true British style Balkan) in them. They were in a way,defined years ago by the Balkan Sobranie 759 blend (in the black/gold tin) and it was a FANTASTIC tasting blend/mixture ! ( I smoked it for almost 20 years and still have a few tins left from the early 80s.) Today, there are two blends/mixtures that I can say replicate the old 759 which I smoke on a regular daily basis: Peretti's Royal Blend and McClellands Oriental #14, both of which I HIGHLY RECOMEND (once again, JMHO )
(an additional note: the original British Balkan blends/mixture did NOT have any Burley in them either, just different varieties of Virginias as a base with the various Orientals as the "condiment" tobacco. From my experience and opinion, I would not consider a blend/mixture with Burley in it a Balkan no matter who makes it JMHO )

No Latakia?

I'm as guilty as the next guy of propagating the whole "Balkan vs. English" thing, but I've recanted, and feel the distinction between them is more illusory than factual. But, without question, any tobacco that bears the word Balkan on its label most certainly does contain Latakia, and generally in abundance. Balkan Sobranie, originally, arguably the quintessence of what we would currently refer to as a "balkan style" contained about 50% of the stuff, and the 759 originally had about 60% Latakia.

I've written it all down already, so I'll just refer the interested to the article...

(As an aside, when I finish the label redesigns, the term will disappear from them.)

Greg,
I'm not a blender as you are, and do not claim to have as much knowledge as you do in this area, but I was always told that the 759 was the Balkan blend and the white tin was thier English and that it had LOTS of Latakia, but the 759 was ALL just virginias and Oriental leaf? They certainly had different strengths and flavor back when I smoked them. This is an honest question as you now ( and I have read your great piece about "Balkan" blends/mixtures) have said some things that contradict what I thought I had known !

 

[glpease]

Most "Balkan" style blends/mixtures are basicaly an "English" style of tobacco with a base of Virginia's and USUALLY NO Latakia. It uses other Oriental tobacco's such as Ynidje and others as the sharper flavoring agent. They also do NOT have any Perique ( in the true British style Balkan) in them. They were in a way,defined years ago by the Balkan Sobranie 759 blend (in the black/gold tin) and it was a FANTASTIC tasting blend/mixture ! ( I smoked it for almost 20 years and still have a few tins left from the early 80s.) Today, there are two blends/mixtures that I can say replicate the old 759 which I smoke on a regular daily basis: Peretti's Royal Blend and McClellands Oriental #14, both of which I HIGHLY RECOMEND (once again, JMHO )
(an additional note: the original British Balkan blends/mixture did NOT have any Burley in them either, just different varieties of Virginias as a base with the various Orientals as the "condiment" tobacco. From my experience and opinion, I would not consider a blend/mixture with Burley in it a Balkan no matter who makes it JMHO )

No Latakia?

I'm as guilty as the next guy of propagating the whole "Balkan vs. English" thing, but I've recanted, and feel the distinction between them is more illusory than factual. But, without question, any tobacco that bears the word Balkan on its label most certainly does contain Latakia, and generally in abundance. Balkan Sobranie, originally, arguably the quintessence of what we would currently refer to as a "balkan style" contained about 50% of the stuff, and the 759 originally had about 60% Latakia.

I've written it all down already, so I'll just refer the interested to the article...

(As an aside, when I finish the label redesigns, the term will disappear from them.)

Greg,
I'm not a blender as you are, and do not claim to have as much knowledge as you do in this area, but I was always told that the 759 was the Balkan blend and the white tin was thier English and that it had LOTS of Latakia, but the 759 was ALL just virginias and Oriental leaf? They certainly had different strengths and flavor back when I smoked them. This is an honest question as you now ( and I have read your great piece about "Balkan" blends/mixtures) have said some things that contradict what I thought I had known !

The 759 was much fuller in Latakia (as you would imagine, with its percentage going from 50% in the white to 60% in the black), and richer because of a different balance of the orientals and virginias. I believe where some people get the impression that some of these old blends had no Latakia in them is that it was once commonplace to lump the stuff in with "orientals." For instance, Dunhill, in early sales literature, referred to London Mixture as comprising "Virginia and Oriental tobaccos," with no mention of Latakia, despite its being loaded with the stuff. Rattray also often did not mentioned Latakia separately in his literature.

Many are still confused by some blends that definitely contain smaller quantities of the stuff, but don't mention it, so the assumption is made that it's not there. One bone of contention I've had with another blender regards the Sobranie produced Virginia #10, their cigar leaf blend, which absolutely did contain Latakia, in addition to orientals, virginias and cigar leaf. (It's not only immediately detectable in both the smell and the taste of the tobacco, I've actually got documentation to prove it, yet he still goes on and on about it.)

In small doses, the stuff can be barely detectable. I use a little TINY bit in my Fillmore, a virginia/perique flake. It adds some important depth and complexity to the smoke, but it doesn't announce itself, except to a few who are VERY sensitive to it.

 

[puros_bran]

Like this Pease guy knows anything about tobacco. Meh.
Muhahahahaha.

Most esteemed and honorable Master Pease, purveyor of tonnage of tonguage and fine tin art, I've always believed that Latakia was a Oriental that WE separate out because it wasn't included in the hodgepodge generic Oriental that blenders have been burdened with for sometime. (as opposed to the distinct varietals that have of late become available). Am I wrong?

 

[Carlos]

Redesigning the labels!!! :shock: :shock: :shock:


Actually I recall this happening a couple times. Just seems like a shock when it's said out loud. :lol:

 

[jj1015]

Most "Balkan" style blends/mixtures are basicaly an "English" style of tobacco with a base of Virginia's and USUALLY NO Latakia. It uses other Oriental tobacco's such as Ynidje and others as the sharper flavoring agent. They also do NOT have any Perique ( in the true British style Balkan) in them. They were in a way,defined years ago by the Balkan Sobranie 759 blend (in the black/gold tin) and it was a FANTASTIC tasting blend/mixture ! ( I smoked it for almost 20 years and still have a few tins left from the early 80s.) Today, there are two blends/mixtures that I can say replicate the old 759 which I smoke on a regular daily basis: Peretti's Royal Blend and McClellands Oriental #14, both of which I HIGHLY RECOMEND (once again, JMHO )
(an additional note: the original British Balkan blends/mixture did NOT have any Burley in them either, just different varieties of Virginias as a base with the various Orientals as the "condiment" tobacco. From my experience and opinion, I would not consider a blend/mixture with Burley in it a Balkan no matter who makes it JMHO )

I've smoked scores of blends that were labeled "Balkans" and have never had one that didn't have have latakia in it, and most of them have quite a lot. As Greg pointed out, the term referred to the original BS blends, both of which contained appreciable amounts of the stuff.
I would certainly agree, however, that what separates an English from a Balkan is that the latter has a serious preponderance of oriental leaf.
Heck, it's not like there's a dictionary of agreed-upon definitions for us to use, so we can call them whatever we'd like, but describing a "Balkan" as not having latakia is a severe deviation from the normal usage of the term. Again, I can't think of a single blend labeled "Balkan" that doesn't have a good amount of lat-weed in it, which tells me that the accepted/conventional definition means "latakia" is a component. C&D, Hearth and Home, McClellands, G&H, Sam Gawith -- all of them use lots of latakia in their "Balkans." Usually, blends with no latakia in them but lots of orientals are called, well, "oriental" blends.
But hey -- a rose by any other name and all!

 

[monbla256]

" Usually, blends with no latakia in them but lots of orientals are called, well, "oriental" blends."

Here's McC's "Oriental" blends and what they describe they have in them:
"A pleasantly robust smoke, Oriental #12 has become one of our favorites, especially towards the end of the day. Spiced with moderate quantities of Latakia and Turkish tobaccos, Orange and Red Virginias provide the base for this traditional English. "

This hearty blend of Black, rich Virginias and Latakia combined with a liberal spicing of Orientals makes for a powerful, sophisticated blend. Oriental #14 is a pleasure, especially for the lover of strong, rich blends.

McClelland's medium bodied tobacco in their Oriental Mixture line, #6 is a well balanced combination of robust Orange Virginias spiced with Orientals and hints of Latakia.

They are all labeled "Oriental Mixture" and all have the Lat weed in 'em!! And one can find many others made by others called "orientals" so you can't go by the label as Greg pointed out The tobacco buidness has had an element of a shill game to it for a long time !! The proverbial "...one mans ceiling is another's floor" JMHO

 

[jj1015]

" Usually, blends with no latakia in them but lots of orientals are called, well, "oriental" blends."

Here's McC's "Oriental" blends and what they describe they have in them:
"A pleasantly robust smoke, Oriental #12 has become one of our favorites, especially towards the end of the day. Spiced with moderate quantities of Latakia and Turkish tobaccos, Orange and Red Virginias provide the base for this traditional English. "

This hearty blend of Black, rich Virginias and Latakia combined with a liberal spicing of Orientals makes for a powerful, sophisticated blend. Oriental #14 is a pleasure, especially for the lover of strong, rich blends.

McClelland's medium bodied tobacco in their Oriental Mixture line, #6 is a well balanced combination of robust Orange Virginias spiced with Orientals and hints of Latakia.

They are all labeled "Oriental Mixture" and all have the Lat weed in 'em!! And one can find many others made by others called "orientals" so you can't go by the label as Greg pointed out The tobacco buidness has had an element of a shill game to it for a long time !! The proverbial "...one mans ceiling is another's floor" JMHO

I didn't say (or didn't mean to say) that an oriental blend can't have any latakia in it. Just that oriental blends without latakia are usually called "oriental blends" (McClelland has a slew of them). But in any case you're right -- there's a shill game of sorts. Or, more to the point, there's no standardization at work here!

 

[mgtarheel]

Just my 2 cents worth. An "english" is a blend that contains Latakia. A "balkan" blend has latakia and orientals which are added to a base of virginias. English blends may or may not have orientals, but Balkan blends will always have orientals.

 

[lb]

The only thing i can think after reading Monba opinion about balkan is that he is confusing latakia with another tobacco.The only time i saw a label designating balkan and had no latakia was with a cheap and unmemmorable tobacco available in Mexico in the '70s. That was the exeption to the rule.

 

[monbla256]

Or, more to the point, there's no standardization at work here!

Thanks, you actually said it better than I !

 

[Harlock999]

After 300 years of smoking a pipe, monbla just discovered that Sobranie was all about Latakia?
Well, I guess there's hope for all of us then! 8)

 

[monbla256]

After 300 years of smoking a pipe, monbla just discovered that Sobranie was all about Latakia?
Well, I guess there's hope for all of us then! 8)

302 to be EXACT! We ONLY deal in FACTS here

 

[puros_bran]

Are you guys for real going to argue tobacco with Greg Pease?

 

[MisterE]

I believe where some people get the impression that some of these old blends had no Latakia in them is that it was once commonplace to lump the stuff in with "orientals." For instance, Dunhill, in early sales literature, referred to London Mixture as comprising "Virginia and Oriental tobaccos," with no mention of Latakia, despite its being loaded with the stuff. Rattray also often did not mentioned Latakia separately in his literature.

This makes the most sense of anything I've heard on the topic of Balkan/English differences. I've read a lot on it and no answer really seems more plausible than this. It's also the simplest answer.

At what point did Latakia become separate from "Orientals" then and why?

 

[itsKot]

I've always thought of it as more of a distinction among the pipe smokers themselves rather than the blend, perhaps with a bit more oriental character as opposed to latakia dominance. Take that as you will, seeing as latakia is an oriental as I understand. But, seeing as I'm not the biggest fan of latakia, I don't concern myself with the distinction (of both the tobaccos and blends) as much as I probably should.

 

[LIPIPE]

I've just completed reading this thread and thanking god and Greg that there is in fact Latakia in Balkan blends. I was almost beginning to have a physical reaction ale:

 

[williamcharles]

Don't English blends have latakia in the forefront followed by virginia while Balkan blends have latakia in the forefront followed by the other orientals? It's what I taste anyway and I have read the same.