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Brothers of Briar

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What we do with our knees in private is our business. :heart:

:lol:

I've been on the impromptu hotseat from douchebag "serious pipe collectors," before. All it takes is a couple of Golden Ganders with their four-figure pipes to sit next to you when you're smoking a no-name briar or a cob to start picking away at your peace directly, or just talking about how great their brand-name pipe is. This is from people I sort of know, and I swear, it wasn't me that stuffed the rest of my burrito in the front grille of their car when I left. That was some other guy.

8)

 
Some people flaunt excess and spew superiority. I think a lot of it is due to shortcomings elsewhere in their lives, but who knows, maybe they truly think they're above others. Maybe they truly think that life is measured in the accumulation of money and fine things.

On the other hand, I've personally met a couple of high grade collectors with impressive and expensive collections who went to school, worked very hard and did well financially in their careers. Although they are worth more than I'll ever imagine making, they are truly down to earth, amiable and caring people. They just happen to want to spend a good chunk of money on "Pipe as Art". These guys smoke em too. Though they don't flaunt them, they do enthusiastically talk to you about them if you ask (I always do, I can appreciate the excellence of a Teddy or a Former) and I've learned a great deal from them.

I think the point is, there are good people and there are shmucks, and the world of pipe collecting, whether high grade or pedestrian, is not immune to either. If you walk up to a guy who's smoking a $1500 pipe and you take your Medico out of your mouth to say hello to him, be friendly to him if he doesn't recoil and sneer at you. If he does, smear a burrito on his Benz 8)
 
Have been reading all the post about this for the past two days and find it interesting some of the thoughts on this. For me, having collected Vintage Fountain Pens over the past 30 years, it's similar to the difference between the "serious" collectors who only collected "mint" ie, NOS or unused pens and those of us who collected and USED our pens regularly. Most folks focused on a particular Brand or Type or ERA of pen ( Myself, I collected Post War European as well as Parker 51's and Vacumatics) and the "users" seemed also to "collect" various brands of ink as well. ( I sort of collected writing paper and I still have reams of various "writing" papers from many stationers from all over the world and various vintages as well.) These "serious" collectors missed out on the various experiences in writing by NOT using their pens ( I know, the $ value !!!! Buy stocks if you want to "invest" :evil: )  But everyone has the right to do as they want :twisted: 
As far as "serious" pipe collectors, I figure if you have MORE than 2 pipes, your "serious" about 'em :twisted:  As for the single brand collectors, that's okay if that's what "floats their boat" but those that talk down a happy smoker who enjoys his basket pipe and the BR he enjoys really don't desrve the appellation of pipe smoker. SNOB might be better :twisted: :twisted:  JMHO
 
Way to round out the bunch, PeeDee.  

There's cool folks with money and stuff, I know this.  Problem is, I haven't been around, in person, anyway, too many gracious gents with high-grade-briaritis.   Only one, so far, guy around these parts named Jerry, most generous fella you could imagine.  He's not "rich" per-se, but he has sold off most of his Briar Lamborghinis and sticks with mid-grade Nordings and Petersons now.   He gets more enjoyment out of 'em.  He can't say why, doesn't care, I figure.

Like real Lamborghinis, there's just some folks that want to be noticed.  There's many ways to go about this.  When one isn't noticed, they get fussy.   And then turn shitty.   I'd be so bold to say very few guys are gonna drop three grand on a pipe and not go show it off.   How people react, and how they do in turn, is another matter.  On the flipside, you have the guys with 1988 Hondas, ridiculous spoilers on the back, blown head gaskets and stereo equipment blasting inside as they slowly past that costs more than the car.  

People and attention-getting.   Go figure.  

8)
 
Kyle Weiss":xwahwmn5 said:
I've been on the impromptu hotseat from douchebag "serious pipe collectors," before.  All it takes is a couple of Golden Ganders with their four-figure pipes to sit next to you when you're smoking a no-name briar or a cob to start picking away at your peace directly, or just talking about how great their brand-name pipe is.    This is from people I sort of know, and I swear, it wasn't me that stuffed the rest of my burrito in the front grille of their car when I left.    That was some other guy.
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I am very surprised by this. I'm not even close to wealthy but I have always felt welcome in the pipe world.
I've built Castello collection over the years on a limited pipe budget and I am proud of what I've put together. :shock: 

 
You're taking my recount as an exclusivity of: pipe = rich = sh*tty. Hardly the case.

It's a people thing. Always a select few that can attempt to spoil the bunch. Hate to tell ya this, but even among the vast good percentages of pipe smokers, a few jerks still exist. Largely, they're avoidable. Except in really small places. :lol:

To those sort, their pipes are a vessel to other avenues of need. Not much can be done about bad manners once a kid reaches a certain age. Even if they're 55+. :lol:

For the majority "rest of us," we're just smokin' to enjoy what we have. May our numbers be always strong.

8)
 
Kyle Weiss":ctuheenn said:
You're taking my recount as an exclusivity of:  pipe = rich = sh*tty.   Hardly the case.  
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I reacted to what I quoted from you.
Kyle Weiss":ctuheenn said:
I've been on the impromptu hotseat from douchebag "serious pipe collectors," before.  All it takes is a couple of Golden Ganders with their four-figure pipes to sit next to you when you're smoking a no-name briar or a cob to start picking away at your peace directly, or just talking about how great their brand-name pipe is.    This is from people I sort of know, and I swear, it wasn't me that stuffed the rest of my burrito in the front grille of their car when I left.  
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In my years I've never uncounted anything like this before and I an fairly active in the pipe/cigar world. 

Kyle Weiss":ctuheenn said:
It's a people thing.  Always a select few that can attempt to spoil the bunch.  Hate to tell ya this, but even among the vast good percentages of pipe smokers, a few jerks still exist.   Largely, they're avoidable.  Except in really small places.   :lol:

To those sort, their pipes are a vessel to other avenues of need.  Not much can be done about bad manners once a kid reaches a certain age.  Even if they're 55+.  :lol:

For the majority "rest of us," we're just smokin' to enjoy what we have.   May our numbers be always strong.

8)
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I agree with this. :shock:
 
I'm with Dave and his experience. Just yesterday, I was at the Richmond show and was able to hang out with an unnamed metro pipe club. Several members have, for me, very big dollar pipes and many of them. We sat around and chatted and smoked for a hour with no judgements on what you bought or were smoking. I love to see their high dollar pipes, but none of these guys come across as arrogant or pompous. This table included some of who I perceive as big deals in the pipe world, but I couldn't been made to feel more welcome.
 
My dealings with the wealthy suggest, re their possessions, not a flaunting, but a need of approval for the expense of the object. It's like, "...am I a sucker for getting this?"  You pat them on the head and offer comfort, saying some equivalent of "There, there, now...it's an awesome piece that anyone would give their eye teeth for, and you are one hell of a man for being able to afford it."

Then there are the others: "That Ferrari has been nothing but a pain in the ass ever since I bought it! It's a POS!"

The image of some owner of briarly exotica lording it over others strikes me as bizarre and hilarious. I'm thinking along the lines of a New Yorker cartoon or something. Any artists in the crowd? :lol:
 
Let me answer as a "serious" collector for a moment (most of you know just how serious I'm NOT, but let's play).

One of the things I've noticed is that most of you have no idea what a pipe is supposed to taste like, or how it should smoke. If I allowed you to smoke one of my "brand name" pipes, you'd be amazed at the difference in how it feels, how it smokes, and how it tastes.

The eBay estate crowd has forgotten or never learned that a pipe does not, in fact need to taste like sulphur and rubber, that it isn't one of the delicate underlying flavors in tobacco.

Nor have they learned that a "good smoker" does in fact not require "a couple pipecleaners" during the smoke to keep things dry.

These things are un-necessary, and for the educated smoker rob a good deal of enjoyment from smoking.

All the analogies drawn in this thread are false - no one in their right mind prefers a Toyota to a BMW if they can afford a BMW.

I will analogize further: I just bought a guitar. First one in probably 25 years. I was hoping to find a magic guitar, a real humdinger for under 1000 bucks. And I found some nice ones, some very, very decent guitars (check out Seagull's SWS series!). I looked for months. And then I played a Martin D-28 and bought that immediately at double the cost. Because it sounded better and that's what I was looking for. Does this make me a snob?


Now, I am finished playing Devil's Advocate - I don't really care what the hell anyone wants to smoke. I know what works for me, and one of the things I'm well aware of is that there's a certain crowd of people who think I'm a snob for buying a 250 dollar Peterson, and a whole nother crowd who think I'm an idiot for buying a 250 dollar Pete and not a 400 dollar Dunhill, and a whole nother crowd who think I should have saved up for a S. Bang.

I've never met ANYONE in the pipe smoking world who actually cared much for this issue. I guess if a guy drops 2000 bucks on a pipe, maybe he would be happy if someone else said "Gosh that's a nice pipe." But is that why he did it? In some cases, I suppose.

For myself, having started with cheapo pipes, once I learned about better materials and the better smoking dynamics of certain pipes, I found I enjoyed those more. I don't think that makes me a "serious" collector, it makes me a "serious" smoker, perhaps, or perhaps better put as I'm one of those guys who is constantly seeking the perfect smoke from each pipe (and any pipe that can't or won't yield it up I never smoke again, why bother?). I don't hope this makes me a snob, I don't hope it puts me on some echelon in the pipe world.

I build fences for a living. How snobby can I be? That said, anyone who has never had the good fortune to smoke out of a truly excellent pipe can scarcely comment on the wisdom of doing so, and I think the "serious" collectors feel that rather acutely.
 
Sasquatch":ghdvyqsf said:
I will analogize further:  I just bought a guitar.   First one in probably 25 years.   I was hoping to find a magic guitar, a real humdinger for under 1000 bucks.   And I found some nice ones, some very, very decent guitars (check out Seagull's SWS series!).  I looked for months.   And then I played a Martin D-28 and bought that immediately at double the cost.   Because it sounded better and that's what I was looking for.   Does this make me a snob?
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Oh no, another Martin snob....<g>
I don't have many regrets in life, not being able to play a quitar is one.
 
Keep tellin' it like it is, Sas !  :cheers: 

There is a bizarre situation in "collectables." Rare, classic violins by great makers are valued as furniture. Their value depends on their maker, period, beauty and condition. A miraculously near-perfect instrument that sounds like shit is exponentially more valuable than a great concert instrument by the same maker with a lot of restoration work in it.

I suspect the same everything-but-performance mentality holds true with pipes. Not that I've ever had that many noteworthy ones (and I'm not sure that pipes like Dunhills & Winslows even qualify), but I know some people whose judgement I trust who have. Not to annoy the cigar-smoking fish, but Ian was one of them. Walked past Iwan Reese every day on the way from his penthouse to the Chicago commodities trading pit and owned more Danish uberpipes than I have regular ones. In his experience, they smoked no better -- at all -- than his beater Stanwells. PeeDee was on a Danish high end kick for a while, as I recall, and found the Bangs &c. he had even less impressive.

The best balance of value (quality) and price going, IMO, is in SOME contemporary artisan makers. As in, given a choice between 2-3 Lane-era Charatans "bought right" (at what a re-seller would pay for them) or one Sasquatch, I'm going for another S'quatch. Putting it up against a Castello Collection & an A-R Caminetto, his tops them. Not by that much, but it tops them. It's uncanny.

:face:
 
Interesting discussion here.  

I think we can all agree that at a certain price point you can get pretty much phenomenal engineering and functionality in a pipe, then its just down to whether the particular piece briar really sings or not I guess - a game of chance really.  After that price point, you're paying for a variety of things like grain patterns, rarity of materials, hours of work/handcraftmanship, rarity of make/model, age/pedigree/branding, etc etc etc.  If someone is passionate about one or multiple of those things, why would I bother to judge their passion against my own situation?  Similarly, why would I bother to judge in the other direction, down my nose?  I've smoked a wide variety of cheap pipes and mid- to high-grade pipes.  My experience is that most of the time you get what you pay for in terms of smoking quality, though exceptions on both side certainly happen, and beyond that its just about all those other things.

It seems like there is a lot of veiled insult and assumption on whatever a "serious collecter" is, or someone who spends a lot on pipes.  Maybe those aren't the same thing, but implying that those people are sad victims of consumerism or generalizing about them based on varied anecdotal examples is just a form of reverse-sneering against people who you think (or know in some cases) are sneering at your stuff.  Reverse pipe snobbery is just as ugly as pipe snobbery, imo, and I seem to see it a lot here - or maybe I'm reading too much into it.

And as for pipe snobbery in the outside world away from the internets, I've never experienced it in person.  Hanging out at the Chicago pipe show and the B&Ms I've been to, I will chat with people smoking super high grades and others smoking cobs and low grade briars.  Never seen anyone judge, comment, or look sideways in even a remotely snide manner, but perhaps I have been fortunate.  I'm sure it happens, but as long as you're comfortable with what you have and it brings you what you're looking for in the hobby, huzzah.

I'd say I'm pretty serious about my collection, and in terms of other pipe smokers only my father has seen the whole thing.  I like to share some of the things I have with like-minded collectors and discuss them, but I'm certainly not interested in shoving them down throats or pushing any kind of idea that they're better than the other person's stuff.  Personal satisfaction is all I'm really after, any discussion or shared admiration with like-minded collectors is just a nice bonus.

Cheers
 
Let me rephrase my post with more direct response to the O.P. intent.

I collect and smoke the pipes I do, and KEEP the pipes I do because they are superior performers, offering easier smoking, better taste, no gurgling, etc than other pipes. I have to like what they look like, but that's fairly flexible, honestly.

Many, many pipes are below par, or rather, par seems to be a pretty low standard for many producers.

So for me, it's not the gold band, the anniversary edition, the perfection of form, scarcity or anything else. IT's the performance, for what I smoke and how I smoke (entirely personal). Everything else is secondary.

But then... maybe I'm not a "serious" collector after all. Just a seeker of perfect smokes.
 
keen smoke":gw2ku0zx said:
 Personal satisfaction is all I'm really after, any discussion or shared admiration with like-minded collectors is just a nice bonus.

Cheers
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And this is another way to say it too.
 
Most serious collectors, at least by my definition of the word, don't openly talk about their collecting. If you are friends, or a confidant, they'll gnaw your ear off, but their collection speaks for itself. They don't draw attention to themselves. It can potentially get in the way of their collecting.

I admire pipes and don't really collect them. It's not a financial or desire thing. There are lots of things in this life I've thought I wanted, and THANK GOODNESS I didn't grab them all. I'd be overrun with stuff. No thank you. I admire beauty and quality, but most of the time, I don't like to make a point of having to own it to continue admiring it.
 
Food for thought : the single most important part of a pipe is the stem.

:face: 
 
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