Why is Buying Pipes (on a Budget) So Difficult?

Brothers of Briar

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Have you checked out the Viking Club Pipe site. They have some pretty nice pipes at reasonable prices & give BOB members 15 % off. Ya Don't get that on ebay.

 
My general rule is nothing over $100, and I have a few pipes that originally retailed for $400+, with the majority originally retailing from $150-250. So, in other words, it's very easy to find high grade pipes with a budget in mind. Patience. Diligence. Focus. Three things our racing culture has all but forgotten for instant gratification and the attention spans of gnats, but if you're willing to put in such effort, there are many high quality, great smoking pipes to be had. And for the fellas who only smoke brand new pipes and battle with budgets and dreams, that's the consequence of being stubborn and foolish. It's harsh, but I don't know how else to word it.
 
Well, Peterson is an example of why I don't mind buying certain pipes new. For a while (I haven't checked lately) the price of estate Petes wasn't much less than they are new. I'm not talking about "swell, old briar," or a collectible either, but say a pipe five or ten years old versus a new pipe. So, I bought one (my first) new...it was exactly what I wanted, and was $20 more than an estate eBay 80S (or two) I had my eye on. Couldn't be happier.

As for the guys spending $500 on a new pipe, to turn it into a $150 estate pipe (or $300 to a $100; $200 to a $75...)? If it weren't for them, the estate market would be pretty bleak. Smoke up, Brothers. I ain't cheap because I'm a rebel, I'm an opportunist who's poor. :lol: I haven't spent very much on pipes, either. By a long shot.

"Where there's a will, there's a way." (...so go get some...)

8)
 
Buying pipes on a budget is pretty easy if you know what you want. I frequent antique shops, second hand stores and one of the best places to find estate pipes is garage sales. I don't really mind buying used pipes as long as they've been well maintained. A used pipe, like a used guitar, that has been well maintained and loved, tends to be better than a new one! It's had time to age, the woods been seasoned, sure theirs nicks and scratches, but it adds character, makes it unique.
 
Yak":sd074ofe said:
The reason is that (as noted) pipe smoking's gone viral now. A couple years ago, $35.00 tops. Today, too many pipers with too many bucks chasing stuff.
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I'm looking forward to it dropping like a lead weight. People are so empty and lost that they chase things more than they ever have. Trends, stuff, pastimes. You name it. People approach things in the most cockeyed ways, too; cockeyed ways that don't lay solid groundwork for longterm appreciation and interest. It was on this board or another how someone started a thread about how pipes get better and better; the first smoke says nothing, and ten years later the smoke says a lot. I hear a lot of talk about first smokes from newer pipers, but you almost never hear continued excitement and proven high-quality smokability months later (we have to wait for them to be around years later to hear such testimonial). It's the sister component of buying instant collections and instant cellars. I remember what it was like to buy 20 albums a week. I could listen to them once, and maybe twice if they were hitting just the right mood at just the right time, but I couldn't absorb any of them. I couldn't tell you about any of the details. I couldn't hope that a relationship with the music was beginning. I was just accumulating music at a rate where the only joy was: it was new, and it was a new package in the mail. I can tell you ever little thing about the albums I heard as a teenager. I can write a dissertation about how each affected my life and how each affected me in different ways in different times. Those new albums bought in a time of too plenty? They mean so little in comparison. Our ultra-fast society is good for some things, but it isn't good for developing complex, rich, ever-evolving relationships. A key component to such relationships is slow absorption.

I remember when hiking and backpacking exploded in the 90s. There were an awful lot of happy companies and startups. Glad to finally have some business and unusual spurts of growth. But out on the trail, it wasn't that fun. More waste and human trace. More foot traffic and erosion of the trails because of cutback footwork. Good for business. Not good for the outdoors and for the outdoorsmen who were going to well outlive the trends.

I'm not implying the present is shit and the past was golden. Been around collectibles of many kinds. Been around several pastimes. There are some good indicators of who is going to be around in ten years and who is not, and they're not much more than common sense. The tortoise lives a long, steady race. Unfortunately, we live in a time of speed and hareness.
 
Kirk Fitzgerald":tzug94dg said:
For my part, I feel the price of Artisan pipes is perfectly justifiable up to a certain point, those who demand seriously high wads of dosh for their pipes, I just don't see those as anything other than greedy. The main thing for me when it comes to Artisan pipes is you are paying someone for their time and for the fact that they are making a pipe which one wouldn't see being pumped out of a factory. But it is not safe to presume that pipes out of a factory are any less in man hours, it's still a guy or a gal sat at a lathe etcetera working a chunk of wood or what ever material for a stem. We've all read or heard stories of pipes from factories that are classified as high end pipes which are nothing of the sort, yet a hefty price tag is still applied to that pipe, from an Artisan, you are guaranteed quality from start to finish. Even newcomers to the World of Artisan pipe makers turn out pipes which leave many high-end factory pipes in the dark ages, had I the finances to do so I would far sooner pay someone like Paul Hubartt or Craig Cooper $500 for a pipe than pay Dunhill $350 for the exact same pipe, I know Paul or Craig would put their heart and soul into that pipe, I cannot get myself to believe the same of Dunhill.
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I would challenge you on that a bit brother. Some of these super high end guys are far from greedy. I know one that bought a bunch of briar for another because the guy got ripped off and had none. Who shared his studio space and is free with his knowledge helping others to learn and grow. He spends a lot of money on materials, and tooling, and spent years learning his craft including going to do apprenticships. Yeah he charges a lot for pipes, but he also makes pipes that very few people can make, and in the end makes far less than the comparable artists in other trades and crafts.

rev
 
We'll have to agree to disagree on that rev, my position on the subject shall never be swayed by another's argument, you believe extortionate sums of money for a pipe is quite acceptable and I do not, that's what makes life so interesting rev, we all have different opinions and values.
 
The big "how and why," versus the personal "how and what." Society can KMA, if there's a way, those of us can find it. The philosophical part can be pondered...

...once I have a pipe. I reflect on my collection now like I did a day or so ago: all of my pipes have meaning and stories, and not high price tags--maybe that's why they smoke so great...maybe not.

I ain't really concerned with it, but maybe tomorrow. :lol: There's always tomorrow.

8)
 
Kirk Fitzgerald":xcmks0e4 said:
We'll have to agree to disagree on that rev, my position on the subject shall never be swayed by another's argument, you believe extortionate sums of money for a pipe is quite acceptable and I do not, that's what makes life so interesting rev, we all have different opinions and values.
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Ok, let me have one more crack :)

I live in the ghetto, we are in the process of buying a community home where we can take in those that are homeless, or those that are in need of affordable housing. I weekly go have breakfast in the park with the folks that live there or out of their cars. I live off a portion of my income basically giving the rest away, and my wife doesn't get a paid job so she can volunteer. I am not saying this to get praise, this is just what I believe my calling is. Now say my pipes someday reach the excellency of some of the top end pipe makers, they are in high demand from top dollar collectors, and the money that they bring in allows me to do more in my community. Is this me being greedy? Do I have to price my pipes below what they are worth (worth being dictated by what someone will pay for them), because I do not want to be extortionate? And who is to say I do not give pipes away to my friends? Especially ones with Lemy on their avatar? I understand your point, and it may be true some of the time, maybe even most of the time, but not necessarily all of the time.

rev
 
Rev, that is such a loaded argument, in the sense that you suggest I would say 'no', adding higher prices to your pipes would be benefiting a vast amount of people in real need, heck, I'd put money aside each week until I could afford to buy a pipe from you if we weren't in some pretty scary poo-poo financially, a huge bill we didn't think was going to surface has surfaced with added legal fee's, but that's another story altogether.

Rev, in terms of your endeavours, I would condone the pricing of your pipes no matter what, there is no need for you to feel you must defend yourself given the information you have surrendered right there. I cannot believe that 'all' High-End Artisan pipe carvers are selling their pipes to finance such noble causes, it seems more likely to me that they are simply fleecing their own pockets. The real truth of the matter Rev, I actual from a personal perspective don't care what they charge, for me as a purchaser, anything over £30 is way out of my own budget, I would have to save like a sun of a gun to purchase a low end Artisan pipe. :)

Sorry mate, but I have to say it, I feel your work is highly commendable, I for one am incredibly proud of you.
 
Some economics and number-think.

If a well-respected pipemaker, worth his salt in every way, worked for ten hours on a pipe, and lets say he is working for $30 per hour--a respectable wage for a guy working machinery, working hard and reasonably to the quality of his craft. Suddenly he's at $300 for the pipe. What'd the briar cost? 10 pieces at $25 a pop? Whoops, two had bad flaws, into the bin they go... Now he's at $330. Using his $3,000 lathe (and various other tools) he breaks one... $50 to fix? Maybe it was just a $5 bit, or a $250 part... But we can't pass that on to his pipe, really, just going to have to absorb it. How about services paid to keep the power/heat on? Driving to the post office might cost another couple of bucks. Provided he's "on the books" there's taxes he has to worry about, maybe insurance if he's smart (machinery and all)...maybe he has a wife and kids, no different than many others...

...when I start adding up the numbers, a $500+ pipe, that really is worth that much because it is that exceptional, gives me no hesitation as to where the money is going. Maybe they aren't feeding and housing the poor, but I certainly am not seeing many pipe makers pulling up in Ferraris, lifting six giggling whoremodels off their laps and dusting the caviar off lapels. Honestly, it makes me wonder why some guys charge so little for their wares, when I think about it.

In this case, I'm at least talking about guys that really can turn a pipe or two. These aren't guys that sh*t gold bricks (do nothing) and then rake people over coals. There might be one or two, but I say the vast majority are guys asking a fair price for their talent, let alone expenditures therein.

8)
 
Kyle Weiss":ils4773x said:
Some economics and number-think.

If a well-respected pipemaker, worth his salt in every way, worked for ten hours on a pipe, and lets say he is working for $30 per hour--a respectable wage for a guy working machinery, working hard and reasonably to the quality of his craft. Suddenly he's at $300 for the pipe. What'd the briar cost? 10 pieces at $25 a pop? Whoops, two had bad flaws, into the bin they go... Now he's at $330. Using his $3,000 lathe (and various other tools) he breaks one... $50 to fix? Maybe it was just a $5 bit, or a $250 part... But we can't pass that on to his pipe, really, just going to have to absorb it. How about services paid to keep the power/heat on? Driving to the post office might cost another couple of bucks. Provided he's "on the books" there's taxes he has to worry about, maybe insurance if he's smart (machinery and all)...maybe he has a wife and kids, no different than many others...

...when I start adding up the numbers, a $500+ pipe, that really is worth that much because it is that exceptional, gives me no hesitation as to where the money is going. Maybe they aren't feeding and housing the poor, but I certainly am not seeing many pipe makers pulling up in Ferraris, lifting six giggling whoremodels off their laps and dusting the caviar off lapels. Honestly, it makes me wonder why some guys charge so little for their wares, when I think about it.

In this case, I'm at least talking about guys that really can turn a pipe or two. These aren't guys that sh*t gold bricks (do nothing) and then rake people over coals. There might be one or two, but I say the vast majority are guys asking a fair price for their talent, let alone expenditures therein.

8)
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:cheers: :cheers:
 
Kyle Weiss":1hzjj1np said:
Some economics and number-think.

If a well-respected pipemaker, worth his salt in every way, worked for ten hours on a pipe, and lets say he is working for $30 per hour--a respectable wage for a guy working machinery, working hard and reasonably to the quality of his craft. Suddenly he's at $300 for the pipe. What'd the briar cost? 10 pieces at $25 a pop? Whoops, two had bad flaws, into the bin they go... Now he's at $330. Using his $3,000 lathe (and various other tools) he breaks one... $50 to fix? Maybe it was just a $5 bit, or a $250 part... But we can't pass that on to his pipe, really, just going to have to absorb it. How about services paid to keep the power/heat on? Driving to the post office might cost another couple of bucks. Provided he's "on the books" there's taxes he has to worry about, maybe insurance if he's smart (machinery and all)...maybe he has a wife and kids, no different than many others...

...when I start adding up the numbers, a $500+ pipe, that really is worth that much because it is that exceptional, gives me no hesitation as to where the money is going. Maybe they aren't feeding and housing the poor, but I certainly am not seeing many pipe makers pulling up in Ferraris, lifting six giggling whoremodels off their laps and dusting the caviar off lapels. Honestly, it makes me wonder why some guys charge so little for their wares, when I think about it.

In this case, I'm at least talking about guys that really can turn a pipe or two. These aren't guys that sh*t gold bricks (do nothing) and then rake people over coals. There might be one or two, but I say the vast majority are guys asking a fair price for their talent, let alone expenditures therein.

8)
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Well said. My thoughts exactly. Well...not exactly.....my thoughts had a lot less words and were not nearly as eloquent :lol:
 
I would also point out that most pipe makers are buying premium briar that costs more like 20-50 dollars a block

You add that to the standard business mark up, that any business has and you wind up in a much higher place. I do live in an expensive part of the country but my boss bills me out at 85 and hour as a construction manager, and if I am doing handyman work in my neighborhood I make atleast 50 usually 75 an hour. And I don't have anywhere near the tool outlay that a pipe maker has. Then german ebonite rod stock is another expense.

There is a reason people buy pipes and cars and everything else from factories.

rev
 
From little on up, I always wanted to be a classical violinist. Not just play in a "metropolitan orchestra," but a professional one. As I started taking stock of my life @ 28, in orchestra number two, taking a break from practicing for an upcoming Cleveland audition, it dawned on me that equating the love of music with "having to" do it for a living was, basically, a vanity trip. Like musicians who didn't have to have day jobs were the cool guys that ordinary people looked up to.

Today, both of the orchestras I played in are bankrupt, and I'm about to retire shortly with (by current standards) a pretty decent pension. Mainly because I got being a cool guy out of my system.

Probably not relevant to this discussion, but it somehow seems worth mentioning.

:face:


 
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